To which I can only say two things, first I agree that Thank God Meyer will not be the head coach at Notre Dame and second it amazes me how badly Notre Dame wanted Meyer and now that you couldn't get him how many of you are thankful, along with the Gator faithful, that he's not in South Bend. To which I can only say Thank God.
Bill, As you well know, if you talk to 100 ND fans, you'll get 100 different opinions. It's like that everywhere. He's a good guy and obviously an outstanding coach. I can't imagine that there would be another college job that would be an upward move from Florida's for many years to come.
Thanks Sid, your perspective is appreciated. And I hope your prediction of him being at Florida a long time is true! Gator Bill
UM <r>Bill,<br/> <br/> As I said in my post, <I><s></s>with all due respect<e></e></I>, thank God we will not be getting UM as the next HC for ND. I can only speak for myself, and my reasons for not wanting UM as HC at ND. For me it doesn't have anything to do with his coaching ability, HE IS A FINE COACH. For me, it's more about something called loyalty. When he turned down ND when asked the first time it shows me that he doesn't feel any LOYALTY to ND. Fine, so be it. He can go his way and ND will go theirs. That was then. Now ND has the talent on hand and has proven the right PERSON(CW) CAN recruit to ND just as well and any of the so-called elite programs. Talk all you want about CW but you can't fault him for his recruiting efforts. Also, the program is in much better shape now than it was 4 years ago by a long shot. <br/> <br/> I'll ride this one out for 1 more season. If Charlie doesn't get it done on the field next year, I'll be on the band-wagon with a ton or other Irish fans calling for a new coach. It won't be for Urban Meyer though. In my mind, that ship has sailed for him. I'm glad he and Fl are doing well. In time, ND will be also, without him. It's all about LOYALTY.<br/> <br/> <E></E></r>
With all due respect Tim I just don't understand the "he's not loyal to Notre Dame" because he accepted the Florida job over Notre Dame. But it's fine by me and we love him. Personally I still think CW will do a good job at Notre Dame. He surely has shown he can recruit.
I'm sorry Bill, but I think I remember the same phrase about a certain Tennessee coach a few years back! :wink:
Hey Tom, didn't he win a National Championship? :wink: :wink: I don't know what happened to Fulmer, he was a consistent winner then things went the wrong way. I thought he was a good coach for most of his tenure, but if I were a Tennessee fan I would be on board with your opinion now.
Well .... at the moment, I believe Meyer is thinking more about FSU, Alabama, and his depth at QB in 2009. And, for you Yankee fans .... here's Hal S giving a little support to the UF band/music program. http://www.gainesville.com/article/20081122/NEWS/811221006/1002?Title=Stills_gives_back_to_musical_roots
Bill, I understand how you can be so defensive about your coach. He's done great things for you guys. At the same time, Urban has pulled a lot of stunts since going to UF. I don't begrudge him for doing his job to the best of his ability. At the same time, I think he burned his bridge to Notre Dame...at least with certain groups of fans. I think it is a hard call. I remember there were ND fans who didn't like Holtz because of some things that allegedly occurred at Arkansas and some things that took place at Minnesota... You can't please people all the time. However, the nature of Urban's actions really give me pause about taking him at ND. He's gotten away with stuff at Florida that just wouldn't work at ND. IMHO anyway.
Corey, I respect your opinion very much. However let me say a couple of things, first I bet that if Notre Dame were in the market for a coach and Meyer was available that he would be scoped up in a heartbeat. That's just my opinion but I do think that. As far as this stuff he's supposedly done I take that with a bid grain of salt. Yes he's a tough recruiter and will recruit until closing day even if the player is committed elsewhere. Personally I expect that if for no other reason that the NCAA has set that day as the final day and that if an 18 year old kid changes his mind then so be it. We've lost more than one that way and the only time it bothers me is when the kid isn't up front or the other coach is playing games and telling them that they should tell us they are committed when in fact they are not. Changing their minds? That's up to the kid. If you are talking about the Carl Moore situation and his girlfriend last year, I believe that would have only been a secondary violation if it was a violation, but an investigation and consulting the NCAA ended up with the conclusion of no violation. Telling Jevon Snead that Tebow was going to be a linebacker? If Meyer truly said that, first I would take it as a joke, secondly if the kid swallowed that I'm not sure he's smart enough to be a great QB. And when he went to Texas he left there also and is at Ole Miss. In fact his TD pass that beat us could keep us out of the BCS Championship game. Hey I understand it the attitude is that, hey you had your one and only chance to coach at Notre Dame and you passed, it won't be offered again. That's fine, but you and I are a long ways apart on the subject of all the stuff he supposedly pulled.
I don't understand this mindset. Is there something about the original communication that I don't know about? Did he say he would take the job and then change his mind? If so, I understand the emotions. If not, where is the "bridge" that he burned? I'm guessing that the frustration of some vocal ND fans is boiling over and getting redirected toward someone who essentially is an innocent bystander.
UM <r>O.K. let me try to MY opinion on this clear again. If Urban Meyer had a so-called ND clause in his contract or had made known in some fashion that he would take the ND HC position if ever offered then TURN IT DOWN FOR FLORIDA he has no loyalty to ND in my my mind. <br/> <br/> He can say all he wants now about still liking ND but when his opportunity came he turned it away because he felt it would be <I><s></s>easier to recruit at FL. <e></e></I><br/> <br/> CW has proven him and everyone else wrong on the recruiting point. Maybe HE couldn't recruit as well as CW or didn't want to have to put in the effort, whatever. <br/> <br/> UM is a good coach. He and FL were made for each other. If CW ends up not cutting it at ND we'll find a coach who can. It won't be UM.</r>
Tim, I don't want to get into a pissing match with you over this, but I have to ask, did he have a "ND clause" or did he make it known "in some fashion" that he would take the ND job if offered? If the answer is yes to both those questions, then I understand that some fans would feel "jilted." I don't agree with it, but I understand. If the answer is no to either one or both of those questions, then I ask again, where is the bridge that he burned?
Bill, That is quite possible. I think the burned bridge has nothing to do, or at least little, with the things you've mentioned and it has more to do with some of the things he has told recruits (allegedly). I think the reason that so many people are buying into the tales that kids are telling about the recruiting trail, is that they keep popping up. If it were just one kid every so often, then that would be one thing but there at least appears to be a practice of telling kids to lie (allegedly) and there's also (allegedly) some sophomoric name calling involved (names Meyer allegedly calls Weis etc). As I said, I don't begrudge him for doing all he can to win in the best way he sees fit for Florida... I was just saying that some ND fans would lose their sh*t if ND did take the guy. On a game related note... can we throw the ball of GD 1st down?!?!?
Tim, you seem like a nice guy and I know Notre Dame fans are not the happiest of fans right now, but you did just take a 23 - 10 lead. However you must understand what you are saying sounds like to a Gator fan? We come up head to head for a coach, we got him and somehow he's disloyal? Come on! In the first place we can go head to head with anyone for a head coach just like Notre Dame can. That doesn't mean we win them all, it means we are right there with the best for a program. I also think we had started dealing with him before Notre Dame decided to fire Ty and look for a coach. It appeared to Gator fans like you guys thought it would be a done deal, and to be truthful so did a lot of us and we were wondering who else we might get. However in the end we got what we wanted. Also, I think that Notre Dame was not the only out in Meyer's contract, I understand that Ohio State was also. Sorry to beat this to death but I just have trouble comprehending how our coach was disloyal to Notre Dame because we managed to get him. Sid, I agree with you. Corey, things he that he is alleged to have said don't really cut it with me. You hear those kind of stories all the time about all successful coaches. But where I am really in agreement with those of you who say you don't want Meyer to be the Notre Dame coach, is that I don't either. :twisted: :twisted:
Well, I think the important thing out there is that they are being said..by different kids...and more important, there is a large chunk of ND fans that feel a bridge was burned. Right now, I just think this is idle speculation... but I assure you that there are a lot of ND fans who would be upset if Urban were named the guy.. it should be noted that there are a lot of ND fans upset right now anyway, and a group of ND fans that threw snowballs at the team. The past 4 seasons have taught me that I am clearly a part of the best, and worst, fan base in America.
There are a lot of reasons why many ND fans have a grudge against Urban Meyer. It's a little more than Urban turning us down for UF. It was the fact that when ND called and wanted to come to see them he didn't tell the Irish that he had a deal already in place with UF. Many think he just let us come so he could turn us down. Also statements were made that were attributed to Urban that he didn't think ND was a good job any more and that you couldn't recruit to ND. Then while still an employee of ND, he contacted and hired his old buddy Mattison who stole ND recruiting files and passed them on to Urban. Also while a ND employee Mattison started recruiting for UF and talked a WR from Texas (I forget his name) into decomiting from ND for UF. The actions of Urban in the recruitment of Trattou where he told Trattou to lie to ND coaches about Meyer contacting him and recruiting him. Weis was naive and thought that a verbal was the kids word. That continued with the recruitment of the DT from Ga (Hunter) who Meyer and Mattison also told to lie to ND about his contact and recruitment by UF, they also lied to the kid about Mattisons move to the NFL. Supposedly Meyer offered the Ga kid's friend a scholarship if his buddy would switch from ND. That kid is supposedly now being run off by Meyer since he's not needed ans wasn't a kid UF would have offered if not for his buddy. These are the things that have many ND fans having a strong dislike for Urban. There have been several players from other schools who's girlfriends have ended up on scholarship at UF, maybe they were completely legit. Texas fans feel like Brantley was swayed by this technique to change his mind. Now we've discussed all of these before and asking a kid to not tell the school who he has verbaled to that he's considering changing his mind is not illegal or against NCAA rules. It's harball recruiting. So if I'm a UF fan looking at the huge amount of talent that Urban has recruited to UF without breaking any rules, I'd say ....So What. I'm just telling you this because you wanted to know why ND fans don't like Urban, right now.
Terry, I just typed a very long response then deleted it. I will only say this, that if Notre Dame fans really believe all that stuff you just said then I have to say they are coming across like they've been jilted by someone they really wanted. I'll just let it go at that.
Bill I completely understand from your stand point. Personally I think Urban Meyer is a tough SOB who is highly motivated and gives no quarter. All those things that irritate ND fans and maybe some other schools fans would be just fine if he were their coach. He hasn't broken any rules, he just believes in playing the recruiting game to win, with in the rules. It's sort of like the hubub that Billy Donavan went through when he burst on the scene at UF. You know many people accused him of dirty recruiting, even the head coach at a school like Stanford accused him publically of breaking rules ...he had to eat those words when he was called on it as you remember. I think the So. Carolina basketball coach also said some derogatory things about Billy D. Many people have speculated that he had an improper relationship with a street agent name Brent Bearup ( I think that was his name). Any way as you Gators know nobody has ever proven that Billy D breaks any rules, and the NCAA to my knowledge has ever investigated Billy D. If we went back to when Willingham was fired, I initally didn't want Meyer at ND because I didn't think his offense would work against Major Div 1 Defenses on a regular basis. But I caught the fever and when the Irish plane went to Salt Lake City I was hoping he'd be our coach and figured if he was he'd figure out a way to be successful. When we lost out, I wasn't bitter, just move on and get somebody else. That's life. I'm still not bitter and I don't really care if he's a hardball recruiter that irritates fans of ND and other schools. If he came to ND I'd be rooting for him. Same for Nick Satan, I personally have never liked him since he was at MSU, but if he came to ND and won, I'd like him. I just want a coach that works hard and plays to win, but more importantly ...actually does win!! I'd even be overjoyed if Bob Stoops came to South Bend!
Bob Stoops is a heck of a coach and he just handed Texas Tech a big loss tonight. The Gators thought we had him when Spurrier left but it didn't work out. Do you still think Meyer's offense wouldn't work at Notre Dame? Anyway I wish you guys luck with either a new coach or Weis proving he can handle the job. I have to admit the loss today was bad.