You know guys you convinced me. Notre Dame did all they could to win that game. They upheld the highest traditions of college football and they were duly rewarded for their never say die attitude. I stand corrected.
hahahaha I knew this would happen as soon as I saw KP's post Don't sweat them KP, kickoff is coming up fast. I see one of our locals here is pressing for PT as a freshman on the DL. Ray is a bad ass.
Well at least in '73 you got a chance to prove you were the better team on the field and not with just a whine.
Gipper, I'm not sure why you are so upset. I said I was wrong. Notre Dame had the ball on their own 30 yard line with 35 seconds to play in a tie game. They ran an off tackle play for couple of yards and then a qb sneak and time expired. Isn't that what everyone would have done?
Only if their season goal was to win the national championship. If the goal was to prevent the eternal haters from finding some ******** criticism I guess they could have tried to piss away the NC but Ara wasn't that stupid.
I'm not pissed at you KP I'm just annoyed that even after all these years a logical coaching decision made late in that game somehow defines a truely great season. The REAL story of that game was how the ND coaches rallied their team at halftime down 10 to a great team and managed to tie the game and have a chance to win with a late fg try. They'd lost an All American running back before the game started and had their All American QB go down in the first half. Their All American center Goeddeke played most of the game on one leg. This undermanned team went toe to toe with the Spartans and refused to lose. And the petty, ******** story of the game was Ara's decision at the end? Of the 3 teams in the running for the nc, only NDs opponents had a combined winning record. Despite that their points differential was 324.(Compared to257 by Ala. and 194 for MSU.) The MSU defense had some all time great players like George Webster and Bubba Smith. They gave up a total of 99 pts. that season. ND gave up a total of 38 and 7 came from a turnover in the end zone and another came after the offense fumbled on the 1. The Irish went into Norman and the LA Coliseum and outscored the home teams 89-0. And the defining moment of the season is ? I don't know if this has ever been mentioned before but there was a lot of talk on campus the week following the game that QB O'Brien, who was a diabetic was having blood sugar level problems in the 4th quarter. Not sure if true but the same coach who ran the ball that day threw out of the end zone late in the '73 Sugar Bowl to win the game.
So what about Tom Osborne vs. Miami? Stupid? Or just ballsy? Does Nebraska preserve the NC with an extra point and a tie game with the Canes in the Orange Bowl?
Dave, you have no business in this conversation. You don't even know what happened. Your comparison with Nebraska's game situation couldn't be more apples and oranges. I understand and am not bothered at all by kp's snarky comments and/or his long memory. I'm at peace with how the game played out. I had my own bout of what kp is expressing following the 1993 season, when ND beat FSU and was upset by BC, and FSU was awarded the NC. It's not the same comparison, but as a fan of the "other" team, I certainly understand the never ending frustration with the outcome of the rankings. What I can say is that MSU's defense in '65 and '66 was perhaps the strongest I've seen in my lifetime as a college football fan. The prior season (my senior year) with the same personnel, playing in our stadium, they held a very good ND team (2 losses, 1 tie) to negative rushing yards. I don't think (am not certain) that it's ever been done before or since. They clearly were a great team.
I had 50 yard line seats at a tie game once: "They don't cheer ties at Notre Dame. ... to see the Irish run the ball on first and second down as the final minute ticked away. ... "I made a mistake," said Lou Holtz, the Notre Dame coach, who admitted that he forgot that the ..." The one and only time I was at a game in South Bend. 17-17 vs Mich. But certainly I do understand why the tie was more than acceptable and even strategic vs. the Spartans. But can anyone say that Neb doesn't win the NC if they tied the Canes?
College football history is littered with controversy over the MNC. This is just one of them. That's why we went to polls after the Bowls. And not surprisingly the Irish decided to start going to bowls after that change, as they knew that if they were to win a Nat'l Title they couldn't sit home. Otherwise we'd have not won Na'tl Championships in '73 or 77. Alabama and Texas would have won. But as we all know the Bowl Coalition was formed to get #1 vs #2 matchups int he bowls, worked pretty well except the B10 wouldn't join as they wanted only to play in the Rose Bowl. Eventually the BCS got everybody, but then a lot of unhappiness over the way the BCS rankings were determined. So now we're back to Humans and we still have some controversy. Last year should Penn State have been in the playoffs over Ohio State? They beat OSU head to head. Anyway. If you are a fan of college football you've always had some years were you don't think the right team won the Nat'l Title.
Gip, you know Alabama went undefeated that year and if they won the NC it would have been 3 in a row (in the AP poll). That had never been done. You have to admit that not even trying to score is not the conventional strategy in that situation. And that is also why some us old Alabama fans remember that game. And it was on TV that week.
Looking at the voting on the final AP poll which was taken at the end of the season ND had 41 votes to Alabama's 7. Alabama did not play a single team ranked in the final top 10 of the AP Poll while the Irish played 4, Purdue #8, at Oklahoma, at Mich State and at USC. I don't doubt that Alabama was a great team, the Bear had a lot of great teams to say the least. He was however 0-4 vs Notre Dame, he twice faced Notre Dame with unbeaten #1 ranked Bama squads and lost. The other two losses he also brought higher ranked Bama squads to the game and lost. But all that said, if I were a 'Bama fan I would feel just like kp ...we wuz robbed! But I'm a ND fan so I say...we were deserving. 8) I do have to point out that after losing the '73 Nat'l Championship to Notre Dame on the field of play, Alabama still claims it as one of their Nat'l Championships.
Terry, losing to Notre Same those 4 games was frustrating but Notre Dame just beat us, all four games. No excuses, no buts. We just got beat. The last thing I will say a out this and I will shut up, if Notre Dame/MSU game had ended in a tie with ND going down swinging, I would still be upset but it would not be the same. Hey, Notre Dame won the NC that year. That's it. Its in the books forever.
Terry , actually the NCAA.com site lists both Notre Dame and Alabama as NC's, but I agree it shouldn't.
Kind of my last word(s) on the subject. I couldn't come up with a scenario that would have allowed Alabama to win the Nat'l Title. If the Irish do what those who say we played for the tie wanted them to do which was to pass the ball downfield then only 3 things can happen. 1. Irish are successful and get a TD or FG and win...Alabama not getting the NC 2. Mich State creates a turnover, scores and wins....Alabama not getting the NC 3. Nothing changes, no turnover and no Irish score, games ends in a Tie and we already know that means...Alabama not getting the NC. Also maybe nobody remembers but Mich State was prevented by the B10 from going to the Rose Bowl by their long standing rule against a team going 2 years in a row. So Purdue went to the Rose Bowl. The Irish of course didn't go to bowls in those days. So neither team played in a bowl.