Wow... I commend your Mom and you. While not a violent guy, I can tell you without hesitation I would have beaten that dude into a quivering pile of jello.
I'm tired Corey, your anecdotes trump my anecdotes. You know, Tennessee is just a few miles up the road. You could move there, be just as close to the things you need to close to, and not have to put up with us. Good luck.
And there, my friend, is the Alabama old boy answer. "If y'all don't like it, you can just pick up and leave." You can say Tennessee is 'just a few miles up the road' but that puts me 45 minutes (if I set up shop at the state line illegally) from my son and job. That's not the same. It's not about trumping. I have never once doubted the validity to your stories/anecdotes. Every single one of mine gets doubted. I don't have to win. I know. I live here. I could go on and on and on about the shitty things the '85%' do here, but I don't in an attempt to keep things going smoothly here. Despite your 'I'm tired' foot stomping little tirade here, I like you and respect you quite a bit. It's a courtesy not afforded to me, and I get that. That's fine, too. You're nowhere near the '85%' but you seem determined to try to lump yourself in with them. We'll have to agree to disagree there, as well. You're better than that. Deep down, you know it as well. This state has a proud, and dark history. It's both things. The notion the people, and history of this state has to be one or the other, is part of the problem. To people outside of here, we're all cousin humping bubbas out burning crosses.. To Alabamians, we're a proud people who have made countless contributions to the fabric of American history/culture..so much so that honestly, America isn't America without Alabama. That's both positive and negative. That's reality. That's the beef. That's the swing and miss that drives me crazy. I don't 'hate' the people here. Mind you, if I ever sported any Tide gear, the only person who would speak ill of me is my ex-wife. That's a win in my book. I get along with them just fine until I choose to identify myself as something other than the cookie cutter that they are raised with here. When you point this out to people, they say it doesn't exist. When you prove it, they tell you to leave if you don't like it. Denial is a curse in this state. Many great Alabamians have fled this place because of it. They write glowingly and wax poetic, but they only come back for weddings, Christmas and funerals. Things aren't perfect. Things are messed up. They are also beautiful and breath taking. This state certainly embodies that. It's something to celebrate, not bury. I'd gladly buy you a steak or a beer. My offer is still good on a tailgate if I can ever get enough extra tickets. My life was stolen by an Alabamian and I've been forced to make this place home. I reconciled that a long time ago. You live here so you know full well how Huntsville, Madison, Mobile, Birmingham and the B'ham burbs are just exploding with people not from here. We're not going anywhere. Change is inevitable. It's life. Folks here should probably reconcile with that.
Corey, I was going to leave it but your reply at least requires a rebuttal. There are a couple of things you said in your last post that I take issue with. Obviously huh? I would rather say, if this place is that bad, why in the Hell would you stay? I was sincerely trying to offer an alternative that a lot of people in this area use everyday. I understand your family situation but I work with many folks that live in Tennessee and have a 30 minute or less commute. I don't doubt "every single one" of your anecdotes. I have discovered a basis for our disagreements. You consider the "I'm tired" as a foot stomping little tirade. It was stated in resignation. Nothing I could relate to you from my experience in Alabama was going to convince you that the article you brought up in this thread was anything more that an internet troll trying to get hits. If you reversed the 85%/15% split I would have agreed with it for the most part. Go back over all of your posts in the past about this state and see if you find 2 or 3 paragraphs at all where you give an assessment of Alabama that is as balanced (in my opinion) as this one. I agree with everything that you said in it. Now, having said all of that, I am going to go on another little foot stomping tirade...I feel we have beat this poor horse until the carcass is unrecognizable. I'm tired. I'm sure I will be re-energized in the future but for now, I'm done.
Corey, I have of course known you for a long time on Prodigy and now here. In many ways I respect you and do respect your knowledge of sports. But for many years you have one group or another in the SEC that you find fault with. It used to be the Gators when Spurrier was our coach, now that we are irreverent and Bama is King it's them. The idiot your tangled deserved what you gave him or worse. He's an idiot. However my experience with Bama fans when we play them in Gainesville has always been very pleasant. I like them and Auburn fans most of the fans that travel to Gainesville. Unfortunately every fan base has their idiots and that includes Notre Dame. One of the worst experiences I ever had at a football game was the year Notre Dame beat us in the Sugar Bowl. We go out to our car and several Notre Dame fans are standing in the middle of the road screaming at us like they didn't have good sense, they didn't. I wouldn't have even known they were there if they hadn't made such asses out of themselves. However I don't judge Notre Dame fans by several real idiots. Kp is obviously a gentleman and has put up with more here than he should have to though the years. He always reacts with class. He is representative of the Bama fans I have met.
Corey re this statement Saying that 85% of the population in Alabama is that bad us utterly ridiculous. It strains you credibility a lot to say such a thing. I will tell you the story I believe I have printed here before. Life usually turns out as you expect.
I'm with you guys, there are good people all over this country. I live in Texas and I read sometimes about how we are a bunch of ignorant rednecks. Sometimes over on the Inside Texas boards the liberal democrats that post there complain about how stupid most Texans are and long to be enlightened like California. BS of course. Everybody remembers that hit job some liberal media jock did on Mississippi during the lead up to the last Presidential election. He claimed to have interviewed the avg man on the street in Mississippi and of course some how they were in front of some falling down shack and only had 4 teeth. That was supposedly the everyman in Mississippi. I'm sorry for Corey's problems in Alabama, but I don't believe for one moment that Alabama is anything like what he reports. I doubt if I would have any problems living in Alabama. Notre Dame isn't exactly popular in Texas either, big deal, neither are Catholics although there are lots of Catholics in Texas. But we all get a long pretty well IMHO.
Terry Bingo! You hit the jackpot. And after meeting you several times and all the time I have dealt with your here I am absolutely sure you wouldn't have a problem getting along wherever you might live.
Something you all obviously did not do was take my suggestion and read the comments. On this board, I'm this lone idiot standing out against the group. READ THE COMMENTS. You will found dozens (by my last count which was days ago) stories similar to mine. You will also find a several Alabama alums or others that would qualify as 'the 15%' very much agreeing with the 85-15. Hell, they want to order shirts! In the micro, I'm just this lone dude talking out of his ass. In the macro, you'll see there are a whole lot of people who would agree with every word I said. Food for thought on Terry's point. I didn't have an issue in Minnesota. I got along great with everyone. I didn't have an issue in Nevada. I got along great with everyone. I didn't have an issue in Georgia. I got along great with everyone. By and large, I don't have any issues at all in Alabama (ex-wife doesn't count). There are boosters, alumni and employees of the University offering my tickets damn near every week.. Since getting divorced, I've had zero issue fitting in and making friends here. That is, until I choose to identify myself as a Notre Dame fan. At that point, the 85-15 becomes very clear. Texas is absolutely, positively nothing like Alabama. Texas is the size of a nation with a rather diverse population/culture that is representative of the state. It's not even an apples to oranges comparison. You're comparing apples to cats. KP, Fair enough. That 30 minute commute has to be in Huntsville, or surrounding areas. (Arsenal, Madison etc) I work here in Decatur. The drive, when you consider traffic after crossing the bridge down 6th, would make this a 45 minute commute easily..and that's from the state line. As for the fair and balanced statement, I don't think you're possibly seeing all the things I write. My issue in this state IS the denial. A lot is just accepted as 'how it is' until you shed light on the hypocrisy of 'how it is' and then people tell you it isn't so. Throw a rock in any one direction. Well, maybe not a rock perhaps a paper airplane. Go up to that person, after letting them know you're from here, and make some sort of comment about the deep seeded, and very much alive racism in Cullman. You won't even have to pick a white person. Just anyone. If they're from here, you'll get 'Oh God, I know!! How are they still like that?!' Take that same person, same situation and tactic and make the statement 'For as far as Alabama has come, I can't believe some areas still have such overt racism in this day and age.' Your most likely response will be along the lines of 'That was a long time ago and Hollywood really blows a lot of that out of proportion.'
Bill, You get your own response. ******** I defended Alabama during their NCAA investigation. HOWEVER, at that time my position was (and is still consistent) the fans/rogue boosters are out of control. I don't trash Alabama's football team. I don't make any such comparison, because there is no comparison to make. They win like winners. They win like they've been doing it their whole lives. While Alabama was down and/or under investigation, a lot of you flag flying SEC fans were piling on them while I defended them. Every single last thing I said about them then, is now proven fact today. (right on down to the NCAA conducting illegal investigations, bribery, witness coercion in small towns, and using the unsubstantiated testimony of rival coaches under the protection of anonymity.) Florida under Spurrier was a crotch thrusting, **** talking, finger waging cesspool of classlessness. I do believe I mentioned the other day, that South Carolina looks an awful lot like you guys did in those days. Zook dialed that in. Urban let the rope out a bit, but it was nowhere near as bad as it was under Spurrier. Muschamp's got them going in the right direction in terms of conduct for the most part. Again, still nowhere near as bad as it was under Spurrier. Alabama has never (in my lifetime) been anything like Spurrier's Florida teams. They win with class. Period. Hell, I had a friend coaching at the U of F, and you discounted that as ******** as well. I told you the Florida players just did whatever the hell they wanted and Spurrier thought he ran the university. You didn't believe one word of it. A lot changed with your new athletic director, and one of those things was handling the Cult of Spurrier. My critique of Alabama has never had anything to do with their program. There is nothing that has changed about that. I've had exactly one criticism of Alabama and that's their fans. Hell, it's not even all of their fans. However, it is a very large group of fans (we can agree to disagree about the 85-15. Hell, you can call it 60-40 with 40 being the bad if you want). The fact remains they are there, and winning just makes them worse. When I first moved here, I didn't understand the hatred (and there is absolutely venomous hatred) for Alabama fans. It wasn't until the winning of 20 years ago became the winning of today that I got to see what was so wrong about that segment of their fan base in full effect. Like KP said, we've beaten this to death and that's fine. I just couldn't let that piece of ******** you floated stand though. By the way, the "85%" is not 85% of the population of the entire state of Alabama. It's 85% of the Alabama fan base. There's a big difference.
Ah yes Corey it's all ********. I will say the same thing about the 85% fan base being what you accuse them of. Of the Bama fans I have met close to 100% of them are fine people. Finding comments on a internet board has zero, as in none, credibility in a true study. As to your thoughts about Spurrier, all you did is back up what I said.
How is that backing up what you said? With Alabama, I've had one criticism and it has nothing to do with their program. It has to do with a part of their fan base. Their program is a model to which others are compared. At Florida, all of my criticism was your program. I don't mind Spurrier much and he is downright funny. However, you guys played classless football. It wasn't even so much about the amount of points scored, it was the manner in which you conducted yourself while scoring them.. or stopping people from scoring. It was like Miami lost all of their shitty chest thumping, but you guys picked it right up and wore it proudly. Alabama is and has never been anything like that. Ergo, that is why your point is ********. You made the contention that my position was based upon them being #1. Hell, my position about them was the exact same when they were on probation, and even before then. It has nothing to do with their position in the polls and it has absolutely NOTHING TO DO WITH THEIR COACH OR PROGRAM. No matter how much fans want to believe, you aren't actually a part of the program. And if I recall your posts correctly, these were fans actually at a game.. right? You don't even understand what's being debated here. Of course, you don't understand the issue so I'm wrong. Fair enough.
Your commentary about Florida football pretty well backed up what I said. You constant defending a position with Bama that defies mathematical logic backs up what I said. We can go back and forth but it's pointless don't you think?
It doesn't back up what you said. You said: My position about Alabama has remained static. Also, my position on Florida under SOS is the same. Your contention is that I am somehow now 'going after' Alabama because they are King. That's ********. There's no proof of your claim 'defies mathematical logic.' Your blatant ignoring of points is almost MCGesque. Were those Alabama fans you met at a game? I do recall you saying several times that the fans you've encountered at the games were splendid people. You did not answer that question. It's a very important one. You chose to ignore the commentary in the thread rather then read it because I guess you just think those are imaginary people. You see, how the technology works is like this, those people are usually logged into their Facebook accounts. Those are visible posts. You can go check the likes and commentary, or you can continue to live in fantasy land. Sure, there are ******** trolls in there. There's also stories from housewives and just regular old people. Are they making it all up as well? Your contention is as laughable as Terry's absolutely uninformed and just downright ignorant comparison to the 'Average person in Mississippi.' (the poorest state, with the shortest life expectancy, the worst health care, the worst average salary and the highest poverty rate-I could literally go on for hours blowing up that straw man). You're (both of you) talking about things that you are entirely uneducated or inexperienced about. It's like me going on about life in Albuquerque. I've been there. They had a nice mall. The sunrise and sunsets were beautiful. I've seen every episode of Breaking Bad twice, at least. What does that all mean? It means I know f*ck all about life in Albuquerque. I have absolutely zero credibility on the subject whatsoever. If someone who lived there offered up something, even first hand internet comments (those are real people, you know), I'd read those things if that was something I was interested in learning about. That's not what either of you have done. You carried on with your ill-informed preconceived notions. There's no way either of you read that thing because your responses are clearly a reflection of someone who has no idea of the premise of the article. So here you two are, speaking with certainty about an article that you didn't read, or at best understand. When suggestions are made in which you can bypass the article and read some interesting first hand accounts, you chose to not read those either. Neither of you have lived here, or probably even stayed here for any considerable amount of time. Yet, you're certain of your positions. You continue to throw out straw man after straw man, some of which actually support the writer's claims. (you wouldn't know that, because you didn't read it) I have no problem at all with Terry's suggestion that he'd do just fine if he moved to Alabama. And I LOVE TERRY, so keep that in mind when reading this. If he moved here, he'd stay in one of the upper-middle class (at a minimum) communities that have popped up around Huntsville or Birmingham. He'd actually be surrounded by a shocking amount of diversity and people who are also not from here. He'd fit right in. That is Alabama, the very new Alabama. I think you'll find most Alabamians (KP stop me if I'm wrong here) would tell you that neither of those are very indicative of Alabama the state as a whole). Nah son, I'd need you to take up shop in Phil Campbell, or Tuscumbia, or Arab, or Winston County or Sand Mountain. That's just to name a few. It's like listening to someone say they know what life in Florida is like because they've been to Disneyworld. You're right. This is pointless. You don't want to read. You don't want to open your mind to anything, or consider any other possible alternative than the one you came into this discussion holding. Good luck with that.
What defies logic is that 85% number. No way no how is 85% of the Bama fan base as bad as you claim. That number is statistically unrealistic. And it flies in the face of what Bama fans I have met. Way over exaggerated.
So you call it 50-50, 60-40, 70-30. That makes you feel better? Let's go with 70-30 because at 30, I'm digging in because there's no way in hell it's lower than that. Honestly, the line should be drawn at 50 but whatever. The article was obviously tongue-in-check. It was not a text book, nor a manual on college football. The fact, and this is a fact, remains that there is this HUGE portion of the Alabama fan base that is just psychotic. Not in that 'get cremated and have your ashes sprinkled on the 50 kinda psychotic. It's the tree-poisoning, throw a drink in a strangers chest, smash your back window where your team's logo sticker is, tea-bag random strangers (google it), punch you in the mouth, scream in your face like I stabbed your child just because you're different kind of psychotic. They exist and it is nofuckingwherenear the miniscule representation that you attribute to it. Paul Finebaum has made a career for himself, not by hyping or over-generalizing, not by bullshitting, not by spinning, but rather by simply turning the microphone on. People nationwide were captivated by the utter insanity that surpasses anything on air since Morton Downey Jr. The thing is, it's not scripted. This isn't the LA Basin where you get 10 callers out of 10 million people. No. You can turn your radio off, walk into a country diner and start that same subject you heard on the radio and get the same exact response. There is no greater disparity in all of sports than the gap between 'good' Alabama fans (who fall into the statistically smaller group of people who attended Alabama, or could have attended Alabama and went to another college or the military) and those who do not. You met some Bama fans at a game or two or ten and they were good people. That's not surprising. Had you read the article, you would see that one of the cornerstones of the bad fan base is that they don't attend games, they didn't attend the university and generally have absolutely no connection to the university of Alabama aside from the fact that they live (or lived) in the state. The 'bad' group so closely identifies themselves with the Crimson Tide and it is all this cancerous misplaced sense of identity and pride. They literally live and breath the Tide, and they will never turn the other cheek when it comes to their beloved Tide and whatever idiotic thing it is that they feel threatens the 'integrity' of that program. This isn't some tiny fraction or fringe element. They are legion, and they are ******* scary. You don't meet these people at Alabama games, and never at road games. Thankfully, Alabama doesn't lose often these days. You'll note writer after writer or even comedian after comedian documenting these things. The bad element of the Crimson Tide fan base is a gift bag. You don't even need talent, just a video camera. (which they will punch right off your face if you catch them in the act) You probably didn't catch all the countless Youtube videos of Alabama fans after they lost to Texas A&M. To believe you guys, those are the only 30 or 40 cases of someone going bat **** crazy. I hate to break it to you, it's not. But you're going to believe whatever you want.
Here is where your analogy falls flat: If I don't choose to identify myself any differently, essentially lie about who and what I am, then I never have an issue. When I moved here, I felt as if I was a man on an island. The further I got away from my ex, my life improved almost exponentially. It's been that way since 2005. The only instance, aside from the issue of religion and my son, that these issues arise concerns Alabama football fans and ONLY when I choose to identify myself (thru means of hat or t-shirt, it's not like I walk down the road shouting 'Go Irish!'). In your analogy, the onus of what a town is falls squarely on the individual and what they choose to make of the situation. By and large, I've done that. I have a large group of friends that networks throughout the region and from Gulf to state line running north/south. Aside from the insanity that is my custody situation, things are pretty damned good. When I fell ill 3 years ago and my family could not be here to help, it was my friends who rallied around me to assist with things when I was too ill and my situation was being exploited for personal gain by 'someone' else. It should be mentioned those same friends are almost entirely Tide fans, agreed with almost everything in that article and would tell you everything I've said here is true. But I digress, how I chose to view the area and adapt my demeanors to fit local customs played largely into things going so much more smoothly. With one very glaring exception..and again, it's not with everyone, it's with that huge group that falls under that category we like to pretend doesn't exist here, things go just fine. I've run the other routes. I've explored the other means of acceptance. Using your analogy, you really need a passenger C. I'd say nothing but good things about the area just so long as you don't identify yourself as a fan of Notre Dame. If you can hide that, things will go well for you. In your analogy, the onus is on the person to make their reality in that town. What do you do when that is not possible? Is the onus on the person, or the town/community? At what point in time do the good people of that community finally put their foot down and say 'you know what, new guy isn't the problem. You crazy bastards killing trees, putting your nuts on people, punching strangers, destroying property, screaming at someone who has done you no wrong, or even throwing drinks at someone you've never met or spoken to, YOU are the problem.' I think you'll find this state has a very well documented legacy of this very same issue. I'm not making it up, people have been saying these things for 100 years before I was born. You've heard these things long before I was born, and people will hear them long after I am dead. Yet you contend, that I solely am the issue. You're a math man, surely you must see how you're not considering all the parameters of the equation. You're solving between the parenthesis and calling it done. You know better, or you should.