Holy explanative deleted Bill. How do you think I am putting you or Tebow's class down? Because I won't submit that this class was the greatest ever in the history of the SEC? The facts show that there is at least a slight chance they aren't. All I was saying is that is that someone MIGHT possibly be as good and yes there is a chance (at least to someone who isn't a Gator fan) that there may have been a better class in SEC history. But you can't deal with that... You can't possibly have that. You can't for one second admit that there just might be someone else who may, note MAY, have been better than this class with Tebow.. If you can't see that, then you're proving any and all theories about the 'Cult of Meyer' that you've denied all along... Well, that or Florida is really a school for the blind. Either way, I'm finito with this. If you can't admit that classes that won more titles (national and SEC) MAY be as good as your class that lost as many games in one year (4) as other classes lost in their entire career.... All I said was that greatness stands on its own. It doesn't need ESPN or FAUX or anyone else propping it up. All I was suggesting is that we really appreciate what happened at Florida and appreciate the greatness (and it was greatness) for what it is. When people prop it up to be more than it was, then it cheapens what happen. So to say I am putting you down for saying you don't need training wheels to ride the bike with the big boys is putting you down.. un explanative deleted real ps Bill, You'll note that Dave is clearly taking the position you are/were avoiding. He can't be alone. Remember that topic in which we discussed the stupidity of the general public in their consumption of what TV feeds them? You're watching it unfold right here in this thread and you still don't see it... because what they are saying favors your Gators.
Terry, Pick one. This is my last post on the subject. Bill seemed to be taking the right road on this. All I was saying is that there are other classes in SEC history that are as great as Tebow's. Dave challenged me to find someone.. The total number of wins is a serious straw man because they play more games today than they did before. Also, as bad as southern scheduling historically is... it's at an all-time low now. I was pointing to some of the classes that the Bear had to say that they are AS GOOD if not better than Tebow's class in terms of accomplishments. That isn't to say Tebow's class isn't one of the all-time greats. I am just offering proof that there are other classes who achieved more or at least as much. Tebow's class won 2 SEC titles, 2 NCs and lost 7 games in 4 years. -Alabama class of 64 won two NCs and two SEC titles. They also lost 4 games in 4 years. -Alabama class of 65 lost 5 games, , 2 SEC titles and won 2 NCs -Alabama class of 74 lost 5 games, won 4 SEC titles and an NC. Alabama class of 75 lost 5 games, 4 SEC titles and an NC. -Alabama class of 66 lost 4 games in 4 years. 3 SEC Championships and 2 NCS as well as the the infamous 66 undefeated team that lost out on the NC to ND. They even managed to go unbeaten, something Urban Meyer... Tebow and Florida have NEVER done. So there are 4 classes who accomplished, if not exceeded, what Florida's senior class did. That isn't to diss Tebow's class.. That is to say there has been a lot of great football in the SEC. But since I won't submit, I am somehow putting down the Gators.. They can go **** themselves. Ban me if you want. It won't matter.
Corey, perhaps we can talk without the profanity. Sorry but you take issue with any number that might be favorable to the Gators. Not complaining exactly just stating a fact as I see it. If you want to compare records with adjustments for different number of games per season then you would have to rewrite the MLB record boot, the NFL record book and even the College Football record book. I don't recall the announcers saying the Gators had the best team over a four year period in the SEC, I remember it being said that we won the most games over a four year period. And I even acknowledged that in my first post. See it should be all right for the Gators to have some pride in what they have accomplished without having disclaimers thrown in. Over the last two years the Gators are 26 - 2, been in two SEC Championship games, winning one of them, we have also won a National Championship and a BCS Bowl. If Alabama wins against Texas they will be the same as us with two exceptions, they had an unbeaten season but did not win their BCS bowl appearance that was not the championship game. Sounds pretty good for both teams to me.
ok this will actually be my last post, sorry... Question asked, answered and ignored... Just like all things Gator. Yet when I answer it, I am somehow ..what was it you said?? Oh yea.. The reality is that Corey thinks that there are multiple great teams. Truly comparing them across generations is nothing more than masturbating with numbers. You can twist these numbers any way you like. You wanna make 2 years the limit instead of 4 and you're claim loses even more substance. The 1 claim they made that can't really be refuted is the total # of wins.. That has everything to do with the # of games played in a season. If you can't see what a straw man that is, there's no helping any of you guys see that there are other teams out there just as great. You refuse to admit it. You'd rather argue and say I am somehow putting Tebow down.. That's not true. The next Gator to offer a realistic perspective about Florida or Tebow will be the first. He's a fantastic college player, one of the greats of all-time. What they accomplished put them in the ledgers of all-time SEC greats.. But that isn't enough for Gators, they need to be #1. They have to be better. I've never seen such as collective case of small dick syndrome in my life. It kills you that you can't be #1 all the time. When you can't be #1, we're forced to endure ******** stats that are twisted to come up with a way to declare yourself #1. Like I said.. its this ******** that led to the anti-Tebowism. Anyone would be lucky to call that kid their son, friend or colleague but he's HATED by as many (if not more) than he's loved... Ask yourself why? Can it really all be jealousy?? Or is it that people reached the ******** saturation point years ago?? It's way more the latter than you really want to realize.
Corey, I agree 100% with this, not just in Florida's case but in other situations where they base the "best ever" on the current era's 12-13-14 game seasons vs. the former years-long 10-11 game seasons. Those kinds of "records" are shams. It's not the same in baseball, where the move from 154 games to 162 was only a 5% increase. In college football, the regular season schedule growth alone, from 10 to 12 games, is 20%, not counting conference championship and bowl games. This year's Florida senior class certainly is the best in the school's history, may be the best in SEC history (I don't know SEC history), and may be one of the best ever in college football. Leave it at that.
Sid/Corey.... This is about total wins.....not who was the greatest because that crown will always remain subjective. I notice nobody has responded to me on those great classes in the Bear years only having to play 5 or 6 SEC games in a season in an era when the Tide had probably 95 sholarship players and another handful of walkons on it's roster. Playing 9 SEC games in a season takes it's toll in this modern era of college football. One other note you may find surprising is that the most wins over a 4 year period Bama ever had was 44 in the late 70s and while this Florida team won 48 games in a 4 year span the mid-90s team under Spurrier won 45 games in a 4 year span, one more than Bama's best.
Hey the Notre Dame 1946,47,48,and 49 teams never lost a game and won 3 Nat'l championships. Had 2 Heisman winners, numerous college and pro HOF members from those years. TOP THAT!!! :wink: :wink: :wink:
Im sorry Dave, was there a rule in place that prevented from Florida doing the same? Was there a rule that said Florida played fewer games than Alabama (or anyone else in the league) Again, you prove my point.
Corey, I edited your post. As a moderator, I did not change the meaning in any way, just removed one word and replaced it with red text. You guys are arguing about two different issues. Coryy says oranges are orange inside and Bill says apples are white inside. Both can't see that the other is right but about two different issues: Someone says that Florida seniors are the "winningest" group in SEC history. Bill's and MCG's point is that they won more games (regardless of how many played). Corey is defining winningest as percentage of wins vs. losses and championships won. Two totally different issues.
Tom, You're going to need more red ink.... 8) I may not see 'em all at first, but give me time! :wink:
Bingo! # of wins is pretty black and white......hence "winningest". The greatest....best etc. is subject to debate. The # of scholarships and the # of SEC games played is black and white also.
Didn't Nebraska have a better 3 and 4 year stretch than all ya alls? (that's SEC and MWC ) :lol: I think we did. So once again it's the Cornhuskers who win. I really hate this guys....you know....being Husker beautiful and all....
I don't think Neb was undefeated for 4 years like the post war Irish and I don't think they had 2 Heisman winners and I'll bet more ND players from that era are in the college and Pro HOF. Just sayin', Huskers were great...maybe even 2nd best!
Bill, I am claiming 7 additional NC's because Alabama just beat the greatest college football team ever to put on a set of pads by 19 points although the greatest team in history did lose their defensive end to a DUI, and I am claiming another 7 NCs because we caused the greatest coach in the history of college football to have a heart attack (or a heart episode or a dehydration attack or whatever it was). Just kidding, just kidding!
Oh no Tom, I readily admit that they are the 'winningest' in terms of total number of wins. My point is NOT to take away from the great things Florida accomplished in this class. I see both the apple and orange here. My point is that it was a stupid statement to make because the other teams were not afforded an opportunity to play XX number of games in a year. The bottom line is that winning in football is defined by the final score at the end of the game. After that, it is defined by conference titles and national championships. As great as this group of Gator kids is... you really can't make a case that they were better than any number of 4+ Alabama classes throughout history. Thus my point... what a stupid statement to make. Put it this way... ND has 6 teams that won NCs with 9 or fewer wins. Is that to say Tyrone Willingham's first team was better than those squads? After all, they won more games in a year... In this day and age in which 'every kid gets a trophy' and everyone is special... I don't care if the Gators want to claim they are the winningest program.. just don't bitch at the rest of us when we laugh out loud at the claim.
Corey, I'm sorry but you seldom if ever admit anything positive about Florida. The statement was about total number of wins and you couldn't just let it go as something positive for the Gators you had to find a way to say someone else was better. I'm proud of my team winning 48 games over four years, it may be trivial or second rate to you but I'm proud of it. Sid, I agree with what you said about percentage increase of games in MLB, but how about the NFL? When I started following the NFL they had I believe a 12 game season, now it's 16 games. That's a 33% increase. Then Corey said this, which is really off the wall. But pretty typical for a guy that thinks the Gators should never be allowed to be proud of their accomplishments. Just for the record, I think Tebow is one heck of a fine football player and I think the first time I hear a realistic assessment from you of his and the Gator accomplishments will be the first. Frankly you just don't seem to be able to allow us that right. But then it's a good thing you don't control that.
Bill, What do you think Corey would have said if I came away from the Chik-Fil-A bowl claiming that we lost that game because of having to start our 4th choice at MLB? What do you think would have been said by anyone including Corey if I started making excuses for the loss? I didn't and there was nothing... NOTHING derogatory written about the Vols after such a devastating loss. Now compare that to what MCG did after the loss to Alabama. Maybe you were not involved in that but try to understand why someone might just appear to be Gator haters because of the sometimes moronic posts that you see here... and I know you agree because of your multiple posts telling MCG to chill out.