"Safety vs. Conservatism..... How in hell did it get to be those choices?" Maybe by changing the goal posts from slowing it down and flattening the curve to putting the country through complete economic ruin and for what??? The statistics don't even show that big a difference (if any) between places with draconian measures vs. those places just trying to put common sense protections in place while allowing people to maintain their businesses...and feed their families. Economic damage has never deterred the left in their quest for power...but this willingness to absolutely devastate the country for political gain defies belief. Maybe it's not a quest for political gain as much as just caused by their political hatred and knee-jerk reflexes...I don't know. But it's mind-boggling to me.
We're so divided neither side can see the true power grabbing going down. I have to ask how when the president and his medical experts recommend shutting down the country for safety then that edict somehow evolves into the "dems are power grabbing" OMG. Here is your real threat.... the real power grab: "President Donald Trump survived impeachment, but in the midst of a pandemic, he is still exacting his revenge. Trump's late Friday night firing of State Department Inspector General Steve Linick -- at a time when America is preoccupied by coronavirus -- once again had echoes of President Richard Nixon's Saturday night massacre more than four decades ago when he tried to thwart the investigation into his involvement in the Watergate break in. But Trump's attempt to systematically dismantle the checks and balances that are the bedrock of America's democracy has arguably taken a far heavier toll. He is showing that he can bend the levers of government to suit his whims, by simply disposing of respected, career government employees whom he perceives as having criticized him, crossed him or refused to carry out his bidding. With the firings, he is demolishing the ideal that inspectors general can operate independently without fear of retribution as they attempt to uncover waste, fraud and abuse that does not serve the interests of the American people."
By the way Texas yesterday had 1801 new cases.... it's highest number of new cases since the start of the pandemic. And Wisconsin spiked to 502 new cases.... also it's highest since the start of the pandemic. By contrast Michigan had one of it's lowest number of new cases in weeks.... 425. Maybe it's time for a huge Trump in-person rally with thousands of people in Wi. and Texas..... wave flag.... cough.... wave flag.... cough.....
Yeah sure in Apr. folks are in bikinis partying in the Great Lakes. And of course eating lottery tickets is essential to one's healty.
Good news, Fla. and Ga. opened a while ago and their new cases have gone down. Didn't make American Pravda news? Oh yeah, that's not part of the narrative.
I said a couple of days ago that Fla and Ga are choppy.... high one day and lower the next then higher again. Choppy is a helluva lot better than spiking for sure....
Those numbers are MEANINGLESS and yet you and a lot of people continue to eat them up as fed to you. Any basic understanding of statistics and sampling would tell you how poor that data is. Until they test LARGE populations with controls... you know nothing good or bad. Based on the few large studies out there, it was more likely 18000 more "cases" in Texas, but guess what: most of them were mild to asymptomatic. Ah... that doesn't continue the paralysis of fear agenda tho, so let's not do it the right way.
The variable Scott is number of tests given so what Bobda listed as percentage of positives would be pretty significant. Not sure if they are testing higher numbers than ever in Texas or not...... that would obviously make a difference.
The variable is what constitutes the group you are testing? Are you only testing suspected cases? If you get more in that method, what a surprise! What we need to know Dave is what is the ACTUAL hospitalization rate, and fatality rate. To get that you have to test ENTIRE populations of areas multiple times with a reliable test. Then you know who has it, who hasn't, and who had it but got through it OK. At that point we can know if the response has been right, too much, or not enough. Right now everyone reporting "data" is tossing sh!t on the wall to see if it sticks, then drawing pictures with it. And if you don't think the media wants this to continue, you don't know much about their business model...
Cases are cases.... that's a number that is inescapable. The amount of hospitalizations from those cases has run 15-20 % throughout the world and it's consequently a pretty nasty virus that no one wants to get and that's what makes it important to limit cases. It seems as if large gatherings especially inside is what triggers transmission the most. That's what it seems like anyway so as states open up more we will see if that's what creates more cases or not. I am certainly one that hopes large gatherings do not result in transmission and that it can be proven to be so before college football season is cancelled.
Once again you twist my words, Dave. I'm not sure if you are incapable of hearing what other people are saying...or maybe I'm just bad at communicating. My point is and has been that everyone should be wanting safety. Nobody should want the disease to spread rampantly. Also nobody should want this country to be completely ruined, completely devastated, by being told we have to stay in caves. We should be all striving towards the same goal. That should be to test the waters...to try and allow what economic activity can be allowed. I believe that NO amount of shutdown will eliminate the virus nor the deaths. I believe that data between various countries and states shows that. This should not be a political thing...should not be a left vs. right thing. Should not be a Trumper vs anti-Trumper thing. I don't agree with everything Trump has said or done regarding this crisis...but for the most part he has listened to his science advisors and has closed down the shop. The shame is in all of the political sniping. I have spent all morning reading left wing columnists compare all Republicans to gun wielding anti-semitic neo-nazis. I have only seen the media coverage where they post pictures of the most radical (actually in one article they had two different pictures but it was the same three militants...I guess they couldn't find anybody else)...but I bet you dollars to donuts that most of the protesters are just normal folks who would like to keep their livelihood. One columnist criticized people for not being willing to sacrifice like people did during WWII...criticized us wimps for whining about not being able to get a haircut or a perm or "get a cholesterol fix in a sit-down restaurant". I get so mad because THAT ISN'T THE POINT. I can live without going to the barber...I can live without going to a sit down restaurant. I would like for my barber to be able to work and not lose his business and profession...I believe safety protocols can be put in place to allow him to do so and should be tried. Will people still get infected at some rate? Sure...but it's happening now and it isn't just the small businesses that are going to hurt. Local and State governments are going to lose billions of dollars in tax revenue...actually so are the Feds. Stimulus? Fine...print more damn money. IT ISN'T REAL MONEY!!! Money is when you are reimbursed with something of value for a service rendered. Our dollars are going to be the equivalent of Confederate Script by the time we are done.
Just read that Medicaid rolls are skyrocketing in Ohio. 1 in 4 Ohioans are now receiving Medicaid benefits. Yeah...we can survive staying locked down for another six to 24 months.
Stu I agree with most of your post except this: "I don't agree with everything Trump has said or done regarding this crisis...but for the most part he has listened to his science advisors and has closed down the shop." Trump used to listen to his medical advisors. Now you wouldn't know it because he stirs the pot so often and does make it a political statement because of the upcoming November election. This is absolutely no time for political divisiveness and rallying the partisan troops at the expense of public health. I would like to know how many times in his press conferences and/or tweets has he mentioned the word dems, democrats, fake news, Obama etc.... I ask why is that? Why should those terms be mentioned over and over and over in the middle of this pandemic crisis?
There is some good very preliminary news regarding a vaccine this morning. One company is reporting that of their small sample of 45 people that all of them developed antibodies. Obviously more testing has to be done but it's encouraging to get some positive news. Moderna coronavirus vaccine: Early results from trial show participants developed antibodies against the virus - CNN I also saw an article on a San Diego Biotech company that has an antibody that may help fight Covid 19. In lab experiments it's been successful in blocking the virus. That's a long way from human treatment. But again a positive. San Diego's Sorrento Therapeutics says antibody might have ability to fight COVID-19
Again Dave, you missed what I said. What about the cases NOT REPORTED/CONFIRMED??? If it's 50-100 times those who have been tested positive... guess what? Your rates went from 15-20% to 1.5-2%. HUGE DIFFERENCE.
Another report of a trial that is looking promising. This one in the UK. The first clinical trial of the Oxford vaccine is “progressing well,” he said, noting that all Phase 1 participants recently received their vaccine dose. “They are now being monitored closely by the clinical trial team,” Sharma explained. “The speed at which Oxford University has designed and organised these complex trials is genuinely unprecedented,” he added. Sharma confirmed that Oxford University has signed a global licensing agreement with pharmaceutical giant AstraZeneca for commercialization and manufacturing of the vaccine. “This means that, if the vaccine is successful, Astra Zeneca will work to make up to 30 million doses available by September for the UK, as part of an agreement to deliver 100 million doses in total,” he explained.
Scott I see the point that if one day they can determine that millions more have had the virus than has been detected then the percentage of hospitalization and death will go down but it doesn't change the percentage of confirmed Covid cases where bad complications have arisen unles those complications decrease significantly. Nor does it change the 90,000 deaths and counting and terrible misery for 200,000 and counting more Americans.
I guess we won't hear much from Trump on coronavirus anymore now that he has found a new distraction for his election run: Trump looks to advance unfounded Obama crime conspiracy - CNNPolitics I think he has poked the bear and poked the bear until now the bear is pissed off and he will not be holding back on his criticism of Trump. You got him going now Donald.....