Continues to be a very sad time for the University. I see that Fr. Jenkins has issued a letter regarding the situation, which I am sure that Gip and Sid have recieved. It has as can be expected been recieved differently by different groups. Many alums and fans have applauded the letter, others see it as a carefully crafted cover letter. Those who are now openly asking for the firing of Kelly and in some cases Swarbrick not just for their parts seem to be most likely to be unhappy with the letter. Esp the last part which they see as a premature attempt to absolve Kelly of all accountability. One poster said he felt this letter was a signal that the Sullivan family has told ND there will be no lawsuit, etc. I almost get the feeling that those who are most upset with the Univ over this tragedy and the whole football program, could only be made happy if a number of high level ND admin including Jenkins, Swarbrick and Kelly resign and accept fault for the whole thing. Of course many media members have weighed in on the subject and I have yet to read one that is anything but very negative about ND. Personally I see it as a terrible tragedy, and I have no idea how things should proceed. Naturally I would like to see the Sullivan family feel that Declans death was not for nothing, that thorough investigations made and results made public, that procedures be changed so that no other videographer face what their son faced that day. I would hope the University do things to honor Declan permanently with something like a scholarship fund for Film Students, Declans sister should pay no more tuition, Declans younger brother should also attend free and be guaranteed admission should he want to come to ND. Maybe even a seminar or annual filmfest named after Declan. I don't know, just that in the end the family feels that they were taken care off in what ever manner is proper and that the University not use waivers or codes (some have mentioned workmans comp laws applying here) to limit the award. Total package should be one that the leaves the family feeling like in the aftermath that Notre Dame took care of them in a proper and just manner. I'll post the letter in a reply to this. [/quote]
As to Coach Kelly and the football program. I can not remember a coach ever being in this position so early in his tenure. Sure Faust, Davie, Willingham, Weis all got their eventually. I don't really remember Joe Kuharich so I don't know how fast he lost the fans. It is so negative that I have a hard time reading things about ND football. I don't believe we have hit botttom yet. I could easily see the team losing all it's remaining games, even Army. It has already affected recruiting with ND losing 3 commits, and where as at one time not only were we expecting to hold on to those guys, we had hopes that we could finish with a good record (we should be 6-3 right now) and pick up some other kids who are highly thought of by recruiting services. Hard to see that happening right now. Should this all go down with my worst case senario, Kelly will have a very short stick to fight his way back. He has a tough closing schedule, he is missing his Starting QB, Starting RB, Starting Slot Reciever, Starting TE, Starting NG, Starting MLB, and he's lost his long snapper on the FG unit. He's playing a true freshman at QB. Coach Kelly is in a very bad spot and while he will survive till next season his seat will be very hot for year 2 and he will have a very steep hill to climb to regain his momentum (the little that he had).
Oh yeah I did visit the Rivals Tulsa board and saw a couple of things. 1. a number of post's very complimentary of their experience at Notre Dame with very friendly fans (with a few exceptions of course) and a general overall feeling that of all the road games to BCS schools that the Notre Dame trip was the best fan experience. 2. I sort of missed it but apparently the Tulsa Band was playing it's fight song with the football team QB leading it during the ND singing of the Alma Mater. Most of the Tulsa fans felt like they should be cut some slack since it was a historic win and they weren't intentionally trying to drown out the ND Alma Mater, just celebrate their own. 3. Some were suprised that their team was booed when it came on the field, I don't remember ND fans not booing the opposing teams when they come on the field. No big deal, visiting teams in all sports get the raspberries from the home teams fans.
Terry 1. I have a tough time relating the Sullivan tragedy to Kelly. Perhaps the head coach besides being in charge of game plans, recruiting, practices, PR, etc. is also in charge of day to day decisions on practice filming but I seriously doubt it. It may have been an assistant coach or someone else in the athletic department who oversees these things. I recall the practice fields being fenced in with wind screnes that provided some privacy. I'm not sure that the force of the wind was obvious to those on the practice field. In any event, blaming Kelly for practicing outside in fair but breezy weather is stupid. If the investigation reveals that he knew that the kid was up there and the winds were dangerous, I'll change my mind. 2. Kelly was responsible for last week's loss and his DC blew the Navy game. If he wants to stay, he better think seriously of replacing Diaco. 3. I don't understand kids we're recruiting. Do they want to attend ND or do they want to play football somewhere? When scholarships were 120 we used to get great players who never saw the field. They cared more about where they were going to school. Now we get quitters who will decommit at the drop of a hat. We need tough playes not babies who don't want to leave their home state a be far away from mama. 4. We're competing against schools that look for top talent like Cam Newton. If reports are true, we know what he is, the question is, what's the price. And, I really question what it is that causes some of our recruits to decomit.
I think there are a lot of things that cause recruits to decommit. The current team climate, the number of wins, visiting other places that seem to be a better fit, as well as some things that are illegal. What are the causes that you are thinking of, especially if the reports are NOT true?
I want to see where they end up first before further comments. I'm amazed that these kids wake up one day and realize that South Bend, Ind. is a thousand miles from home, or that ND requires that the football players attend and pass real classes. Curious to me, Fla. already has 3 losses this season. A down year for them, how many decomits have they had this season?
So what does that have to do with the Gators gipper? Since we got in trouble in the 80's our program has not had any run ins with the NCAA other than secondary self reported type violations that happen with most schools. I don't believe Notre Dame was even recruiting Cam Newton and the Gators certainly were not. Also, the SEC has known about this since Jan. and the NCAA was informed some time ago also. We will see what happens, but it strikes me that Notre Dame fans would be better off focusing on what they need to do and not trying to find excuses at the expense of other schools. Just a friendly observation.
KP wrote I was just curious about whether or not it had any effect on your recruiting. Geez as usual touchy as ever.
Gip holding on to players who verbal has been a problem for awhile now, however to be fair we have also gotten more than a couple of players who were committed to somebody else then changed their minds for ND. For example: These players were verbally commited to somebody else and changed their minds to sign with ND in Feb 2010. It's a two way street. Chris Badger was a Stanford commit Danny Spond was a Colorado commit Tate Nichols was a Stanford commit Luke Massa was a Cincy commit Tai-ler Jones was a Stanfor Commit Louis Nix was a Miami Commit
gipper, sounds good to me. Terry, with the kids committing earlier than they did ten years ago or so I think we see more of these de-commitments, when they waited until signing day to sign then we did not know whether they had given their word elsewhere or not.
GIF If you ask a question at least wait for an answer. And it you don't want to wait for an answer then don't offer an answer.
Let's rewind KP mentioned some factors that could contribute to decomits such as team climate and number of wins. I wondered if the GATORS were having a similar problem with their struggles this year. Got a completely unresponsive answer and decided to drop the matter and see if Texas was having a similar problem. Now.... :?:
Ok gipper let me give you the benefit of the doubt that you are not taking a cheap shot at the Gators or the SEC. In answer to your question I think the reason three losses will not hurt the Gator recruiting is that for the last 20 years we have been winning consistently, putting a lot of players in the NFL and it's fun to play at Florida. One season of losing 3 or more games is not a killer and in fact might help where it comes to early playing time. What could hurt us is doubts about Meyer staying at Florida, I think that is less now, and some of the negative stuff that has been written about the Gators. Typical I think of a lot of teams when they are on top. Where it comes to commits and de commits as I said above some of the kids who used to wait until the last minute may have changed their mind but we didn't know. I do think we have some advantages over Notre Dame at this point in time with how we have been winning for the last 20 years, our academics while more stringent than average are not as stringent as Notre Dame. That's a tough one to have to overcome at this time in College football. I hope your new coach gets it back on track as the college football scene is probably better off with a good Notre Dame program. That's the best I know how to say.
Gip wasn't taking cheap shots at Florida and the SEC.. that's what I'm here for. Back on subject.. 1. What an unspeakable tragedy. It makes the whole season just moot in my eyes. 2. We're really shitty.. Someone tell me why we fired Charlie again? I mean, we had no defense but we had an offense (even when the backup played).. now we have no offense, no defense.. just awful