Dirty Bastards

Discussion in 'The Back Room' started by Motorcity Gator, Jun 8, 2010.

  1. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    "The BP official wanted workers to replace heavy mud, used to keep the well's pressure down, with lighter seawater to help speed a process that was costing an estimated $750,000 a day and was already running five weeks late, rig survivors told CNN.

    BP won the argument, said Doug Brown, the rig's chief mechanic. "He basically said, 'Well, this is how it's gonna be.' "

    That was a quote from a survivor of the explosion about what went down that day on the rig. Apparently that decision to save money.....cut corners....precipitated the explosion and subsequent disaster that has ensued.

    http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/06/08/oil.rig.warning.signs/index.html

    You can't tell me that these "brilliant" oil engineers do not understand the dangers of those budget trimming decisions at the expense of safety. If they don't then what in the hell are we doing allowing drilling in an area that can be summarily destroyed by such blunders by people with so little knowledge of what might happen.
     
  2. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    It's almost surreal how we are as a nation are just now becoming aware of just how careless these oil companies are with our environment:

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37746494/ns/world_news-the_new_york_times

    I am becoming shocked with each piece of news like the above article.

    I have said before that what is being being violated more than anything else is our collective trust.

    Trust is tied in directly with honesty....integrity....compassion.

    Since when do we not care about trust?

    Do we really believe....as I have been told here on this board....that those qualities are not important in today's business environment?

    I think most of us have trusted these guys to know what they are doing....and take into account seriously our environmental concerns....and take the necessary precautions to prevent these kinds of disasters.

    Now we find out they really and truly don't give a crap about it.....that profits do in fact rule the universe at the expense of people's trust.

    By violating our trust as they have BP has now soured the business operating climate for all big oil companies and maybe that is a good thing considering what has happened in Nigeria as described in the article.
     
  3. Terry O'Keefe

    Terry O'Keefe Well-Known Member Administrator

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    Can we trust your industry?
     
  4. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    Terry,

    The DOT does regulate the trucking industry with regard to safety standards and accountability.

    That doesn't mean that a driver can't and won't make a mistake.....that could result in fatalities or that he could have an equipment failure that maybe a shoddy operating company in search of profits should have fixed.

    But I'll guarantee you that company would be completely shut down and out of business if they had safety violations that were as numerous and as egregious as BP's saftey record showed.
     
  5. Terry O'Keefe

    Terry O'Keefe Well-Known Member Administrator

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    Well I don't know about that, I have seen numerous incidents where poorly trained, sometimes illegal immigrants are the drivers of trucks that cause accidents and kill people. An attorney that I personally knew, was killed along with his whole family in an accident with a truck that was driven by a illegal mexican who had no training what so ever in driving the truck, just given the keys and told to drive it from point a to point b. Happens way too often.

    Now I would grant you that a company like UPS probably has rigorous and ongoing safety training. But as an industry I have little faith that it is the norm.
     
  6. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    Granted the fly-by-night, small or single operators need even more regulation than they are currently getting. Larger trucking operations get hurt financially by these guys because there are expenses involved in making safety an important part of doing business....a priority that BP obviously chose to to ignore.

    A large trucking company could not get away with what BP got away with because the DOT wouldn't allow it.

    And...I think that is the basis for statements I have seen made that there will be a criminal investigation.
     
  7. Stu Ryckman

    Stu Ryckman Well-Known Member

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    Again, brings up the question...WTF was OSHA doing??? They knew about all those infractions...they were the ones doing the citations.
     
  8. Tennessee Tom

    Tennessee Tom Well-Known Member Administrator

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  9. Gator Bill

    Gator Bill Well-Known Member Administrator

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    Let me ask you this MCG. How complicit is our government when you know that BP, and other oil companies, want to drill in 500 feet of water where they can get the same oil, but our government forced them to dig at 5000 feet.

    The crisis would likely be over now if they had drilled at 500 feet.

    I am not letting BP off the hook, but am pointing out there is plenty of blame to go around.
     
  10. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    There certainly is plenty of blame to go around.

    Also...I looked and couldn't find any reference that made it clear the GOP knew deep water drilling would actually endanger the coastline much more so than shallow water drilling.

    Is this information they held privately? Why wasn't this debated publicly?

    .....Does anyone know the real truth of this question I am asking or is repeating the right wing radio rhetoric all you guys can muster?
     
  11. Stu Ryckman

    Stu Ryckman Well-Known Member

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    We can do without the insults...you wanna discuss things, fine.
     
  12. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    Stu...I have heard it repeated from the right that if the oil companies were allowed to drill in shallow water then everything would be cool.

    It's put out there as if the potential for this monumental deep water accident and subsequent environmental disaster was an "I told you so moment" for the GOP when I don't see the evidence that was the case.

    I can't stand people who want to take credit after the fact.
     
  13. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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    I'm not in the oil drilling business but it seems to me that accessing, removing and cleaning up oil just might be easier and quicker in 500 ft of water than it is in 5000 ft.

    Maybe I'm wrong.
     
  14. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    Makes sense to me George.

    I would say the GOP then is just as responsible as the Dems for this deep water rig because I am sure they agreed to the placement of the rig as an alternative to the shallow placement.

    They should have known better is what I am hearing here.
     
  15. Stu Ryckman

    Stu Ryckman Well-Known Member

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    Bull. It isn't a GOP vs. Dem thing. Anti oil folks forced the drilling out. Maybe nobody saw the danger. Doesn't mean it's innaproriate to bring it up now. If someone says "I warned you " then fine. Call them on it.
     
  16. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    It is inappropriate if it is a point made for political gain.
     
  17. Stu Ryckman

    Stu Ryckman Well-Known Member

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    Maybe they are brining it up because it's true...
     
  18. Motorcity Gator

    Motorcity Gator Well-Known Member

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    Might be true....in hindsight.....but think of the brownie voting points they could have gained if they would have said what a danger deep water drilling was....before they voted to OK it or better yet if they refused to vote for it because it was such a risk. :wink:
     
  19. Terry O'Keefe

    Terry O'Keefe Well-Known Member Administrator

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    Drilling for oil has always been a dangerous and risky business, not just for the things that go wrong and hurt people and the environment, but the financial risk with regard to how much or if there is any oil down there in the first place. Although I admit new technology for discovering oil is so much better than that old devining rod or the wildcaters gut that it's not near the risk of drilling a dry hole as there used to be.

    Also just about every thing we do with regards to energy production has unavoidable risks. 3 Mile Island come to mind, not to mention mine collapses or the damage to the surround environment from coal mining, copper mining, silver mining, mining for anything. Hey and don't forget the birds killed by windmill power, the views ruined of the rich democrats off of Cape Cod or Nantucket!!

    Don't forget the upset to the market done by greedy farmers selling all their corn to green friendly alcohol producers!!

    Heck those trucks you run to move those big boats down the highway damage the interstate highways system more than any other thing on the road. Maybe we should ban those!! :wink:
     
  20. Tennessee Tom

    Tennessee Tom Well-Known Member Administrator

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    No Terry! That doesn't fit Dave's agenda. That can't be the right thing to do. :roll: