Corey....I think as your post shows....and your history of posts about him shows that Urban can do no right by you. God forbid he did leave Utah as Kelly did Cinci or else I am sure I would have been hearing about that for past four years. :roll:
You actually getting into citing sources or are you just going to keep using broad brush strokes like they are facts? That's a lot of ******** there. I think Urban sticks up for his kids well and there is a lot to be said for that. I think he is a good, marketable face for the university and I don't think he will ever tarnish the school in any sorta Mike Price kind of way. At the same time, I believe he lies to recruits. I believe he will do or say anything to land the top talent. That is always a good way to get to the top, I'm just not sure it's a good way to stay there. I think he is perhaps the greatest special teams coach in America. He has shown tremendous flexibility in his offensive styles over the years while essentially running the same offense. There are many pluses to the man as an HC.. There are also minuses. The difference between you and I is that, you don't even want to recognize the possibility of a minus..
I just got through watching his ND press conference, I didn't see the whole thing this afternoon. It fired me up and I head butted my computer! Put me in coach, I'm ready to go!
Lest we forget http://www.herald-dispatch.com/homepage/x2054234082 http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=3157227 And finally, the richest state in the union pisses away some of it's money http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/football/index.ssf/2008/07/michigan_will_pay_25_million_t.html
In Kelly's (and most guy's) defense, the way the press hounds the coaches for a comment every time there is an opening, how are they supposed to respond? Before the season is over they are relentlessly asked the same question over and over and they still have games to play and players to recruit for their present employers. If they say "no comment" that just fuels the fire, if they say they are staying, it is parsed to determine if there is any indication that they may be leaving and the questions continue. "Are you or are you not going to the ZXCB coach next year?" And if they say they are going they lose the team for the rest of the season not to mention if the negotiations are not complete, they have just burned the bridge to keeping their present job. Once the press gets after a coach that is a candidate for an opening the poor SOB is put in the position of either lying or alienating his current team/employer. These guys make a lot of money but there is no good way of changing jobs.
I think the norm is definitely to leave before the bowl game. Kelly is no different than 95% of coaches going to a better job. Two things about Urban.... he was obviously not so hated by fans and administration as to have felt compelled to get on down to his new Florida job and he was extremely motivated to finish with his players at a school that had never been to a BCS bowl before.
Would Urban be the Gator coach today if Florida had said he couldn't coach Utah in it's bowl game? Just wondering... PJ in Jersey
Terry, Remember that as we age, we lose calcium in our bones. Head butting anything could have bad results! 8)
KP, That puts everything into perspective. Not that we didn't already know this... but that we needed to be reminded. Thanks!
I agree. Once the press gets a sniff (or makes up one) they ask you the question a million different ways. None of which you can answer. I do feel bad for the UC kids, and I have felt bad for other teams whose coach left after the season for another team. But as was pointed out it's a 2 way street, how many of those players would stay an extra year with the coach if they could go to the NFL early, even if the team really needed them to stay, some but more would go. Also considering how many players these day make verbal commitments (recruiting) to teams, then late in the game get an offer that they like better call and say they are sorry but they are going to team B instead.
I don't know PJ, but I do know it was not an issue. In the circumstances we were in it didn't make sense for him not to coach. I think that is true in most cases that is the case. Rich Rod had a tough parting with West Virginia and I think they decided he wouldn't coach. Ron Zook was allowed to coach through to the end of the season but he got the job in Illinois and didn't coach our bowl game, I think he could have but moved on.
On Kelly... I'm not sold. I think a change was needed. I also think Kelly is the son of a Masshole (that is a term of endearment btw) politician and that can be a double edged sword. I think he can wear multiple masks ala Lou Holtz.. Holtz is a man of incredible character, but he also is a world class BSer who can spin the tales with the best of em.. When Holtz sat down in your living room, you knew just who he was. His ability to BS, or 'the gift of gab' as my dad likes to refer to it, is well known... but you knew just who he was and his portrayal of himself was genuine. I can see Kelly being different people to different recruits. I think he will keep switching positions if need be.. I worry about him throwing people under the bus.. I don't think he fully understands the level of scrutiny that he will be under.. At the same time... if he is as cut throat and ruthless about this as I hope he is going to be.. he won't play the sucker.. He worked the Hart campaign so that doesn't give me a lot of hope for this, but it's my hope regardless. For all the Charlie is a bad guy press.. the truth seems to be quite the opposite. He does a 60 minutes piece thinking it will be good press and then is surprised they edited it all down to show him in a really unflattering light.. An absolute hatchet job was done, when he thought it would be a fluff piece that would build brand recognition for Hannah and Friends.. That's the NFL mindset and why I think those guys sometimes struggle in college.. There is a certain cut throat, lack of character in college football in general but especially the media... and endless hypocrisy that no one ever addresses. When prompted for a 60 minutes interview, I hope Kelly tells them he'd gladly meet with them...and the rest of the press corps at his next regularly scheduled press conference. In the NFL, you can't do a guy the way you did Charlie without risking some serious 'dead man walking' implications to your career.. at least not without a whole lot of facts behind you. There is limited key cards with access to football at that level. At times, there is something to be said for inbred royalty. I don't think Charlie even expected the things that became his undoing to even be an issue. I think at the end of the day, he's right.. he belongs in the NFL. It takes a different type of guy to have success (usually) in college football.. Kelly has shown he can have success... but can he do it walking the highwire during a pouring rain storm with people firing bullets at him??? That remains to be seen... his mouth worries me.
Corey, I though the term "Masshole" was coined in the business world to describe the people skills and general humanity of Boston executives. Kelly may have lived long enough in the Midwest to have some of that wear off. His Dad may be a different story. :wink:
2K/year in Grand Rapids? Doesn't that put you in the top 10% I wonder if he supplemented his income with Amay sales?
Yeah Terry.....like many workers in Michigan today he would be taken off the state unemployment listings with that job.... :roll: Actually I think there is a conundrum of sorts going on in places like Michigan especially for salespeople for example because while no one hardly will offer decent starting salaries to begin work they offer jobs with commission "promise" if you go out and set the world on fire in the midst of a poor economic climate. Might sound desperate to take a job like that but desperate times call for desperate measures. The disconnect occurs however in that if you take one of these very uncertain jobs you are off the guaranteed unemployment payroll. It is a big dilemma for the unemployed and I think it should be addressed because people that want to work are obviously discouraged from accepting these kinds of jobs. Similarly, in Kelly's case he had to work a job opportunity at poverty wages because it was his chance at the big time.....which he was fortunately able to ascend to.
I lived in Grand Rapids for four yrs...worked right around the corner from Grand Valley...had a pass for their student rec facility...Great town to live and raise a family in...I loved GR.