I would welcome all comments to this but I would especially like to hear from our resident historian, JO'Co, who's perspective I value immensely. It appears to me that a new style of fascism is taking root in the USA, perpetrated exclusively by the Progressive Left. Led by a more than willing mainstream media as well as both the entertainment and sports industries and fanned by the Democratic party who finds themselves in ashes after the last election. The intimidation tactics, the politicizing of everything, the admonitions by celebrities, the boycotts, the total willingness to abandon our rights as US citizens and give them away like party favors to anyone who demands them from anywhere, the constant derision and threats against religion, rights to life, police, the armed services all add up to a climate of fascist anarchy that is going to lead to disastrous circumstances as the divisions harden. Normally you would assume anarchy is perpetrated by a government against its people. In this case it is half a population forcing it on the other. We are ripe for a fall in my opinion.
An interesting idea, and one I can't argue with. You forgot to mention how they hide behind the greatest shield: labeling their opposition as fascists. Certainly the left can't be accused if the right is full of fascists...
It's the most peculiar thing, the newly elected administration and the voter base who voted it into office are barraged on a daily basis as being fascist. Meanwhile the individuals and groups who are making the accusations are employing fascist tactics and maintaining the singular thought process that it's our way or the highway...The party of tolerance has become the intolerant of everything...
The NFL is warning the state of Texas of consequences should they not make their public restrooms accessible to whatever sex a transgender feels like on a particular day. I just boycotted the entire 2016-17 NFL season because of their indifference to players disrespecting the flag and anthem. Looks like this may be able permanent separation.
You play by a set of rules that don'y apply. 33 states by electoral vote is a mandate. You need to pray that California never makes good on their lame threat to secede or that the san Andreas fault finally breaks breaks through or the democrats will never win another national election.
Does "the other" expect things are going to clear up and become clear sailing with the next democratic president, a precedent has been set by the actions put in play at the loss of their presidential choice. And just to stop you before you start to say this started 8 years ago with the Obama election, what we are experiencing is nothing similar, matter of fact this is what the left predicted would happen with a Trump loss but with an added arrogant grin. But you have to realize by now as the media, liberals and Democratic Party play out their dissatisfaction with the current events it only throws more support towards the other direction with every protest. The refusal to find common ground with the so called deplorables and connect to areas other than major metropolitan areas is a travesty and their downfall... Every babbling accusation, every attempt to guilt by identity politics is just an excretion of warm air seeping out that has no impact other than it's foul odor. it only fuels the separation that is the Trump election and the push to right of center..
A precedent was set in 1973 with Watergate and then revenge for that began in 1997 and so the back and forth pattern of discord and disagreement was set and continues to worsen.
By far the red states of Florida and Texas had more Trump voters than any other state in the election... by far at 4.6 million votes each. The only other state to come close to that kind of support for Trump? California at 4.4 million votes..... :lol: :wink: https://www.scribd.com/document/334553488/2016-Popular-Vote-Totals-by-State#from_embed
:idea: I agree with the descriptions of California as a nascent fascist state and it's been coming for a long time. I actually began my political life as a far-left, long haired, demonstrator. As I observed politics on the left (1968-74), I noticed several troubling trends. Among these beliefs were: 1. A win-at-all-costs mentality. 2. The ends justify the means. 3. The greatest heroes are the greatest victims. 4. All white men are evil. 5. All women and non-white men are victims. I began to seriously question my beliefs 1974 when I ran the Congressional campaign of my friend's father as my senior project in college. As part of my duties, I ran messages between the Democratic and Republican Party headquarters. What a contrast! The Republican side was filled with small business owners, housewives and retired people. The Democratic side (I was a Democrat) was filled with union bosses, except for one old Commie named Jerry Voorhis, whose claim to fame was losing his Congressional seat to local lawyer Richard Nixon in 1946. I remember thinking, "Where are the people on our side?" They talked about all the "victims" as voting blocks to be used. There was no discussion of problem solving: just winning. In the campaign, I saw people being bribed (including a judge); F-bombs dropping like snow (by the governor) and enough cynicism to drown all the tears at an Irish funeral. I kept wondering, "How in hell did I get on this side?" Eventually I left for the other party, and I've never regretted it. Here we are, all those years later, and all of my concerns about the Democratic Party have come true. Fascism is the only word for it. Freedom of speech is dead here. Republican and conservative groups are being removed from campuses all over the state. In Berkeley, the police stand aside as those who disagree are beaten and bloodied. The politicians who run the state all live in the same COUNTY; despite the fact that this is the most populous state. BTW, that foul mouthed governor is still there too. Nothing can change here. Forty percent of the people favor secession and the immediate impeachment of President Trump. The lefties have locked down the state tighter than a gnats arse and a government employee such as myself can't be too specific... ............United States of Chicago......JO'Co
I knew I would get a well thought out response and you did not disappoint! I originally registered as a Democrat as well in 1972, coming from a very middle class, blue collar, Catholic, union midwestern family. My first presidential vote was for Jimmy Carter. I officially re-registered as a Republican in 1979. My father told me I was the first Republican in my family's history! Disgusted with the weakness of the GOP in general and its entrenched leadership in particular, I revoked my status as a registered republican in 2013 and officially became a registered independent or "unafilliated" voter as they say here in NJ. As of this writing I hold both established parties in equal contempt. Your charicature of the Democratic party is rignt on the money; firmly fascist in its approach, enslaving minorities with bogus entitlements while convincing them that they are too inept to make it without them. Demonizing all opponents with racial slurs and slews of "isms". They are no different than Hitler's early Nazi movement of the 1930's.
I don't understand your point? Are you trying to say California was a vigorously contested state? Even though, by your reference, Clinton had 8.75 million votes, taking 2/3 of the votes in that state? (I will reiterate here Scott's point that, if you take California off the board, Trump wins the popular vote by more than 1 million votes. Or, let's do this: By far the blue county of Los Angeles had more Trump voters than any other county in the election...by far at 620,285. The only other county to come close to that kind of support for Trump? Orange at 472,669. Even though he only had 23% of the voters in LA County, he obviously had more support there than anywhere else in California. :/ You know what's close to 4.6 million? 33% of 13.2 million (number of votes in Cali). You know what's also close to 4.6 million? 1% of 460 million (relatedly meaningless).
WSU they just make it sound like Cali is some other worldly place ... totally unique to America. It may have millions of liberals of all kinds.... but it also has millions of right wing conservatives as well. It's part of America the same as Oklahoma, Florida and Texas are part of America. In Florida and Michigan Trump won the popular vote barely and yet gets the whole electoral vote tamale. That is a flawed system.... and is severely outdated for the demographic make-up of today's America.
And small states get as many votes as big states in the Senate and everything about our system is flawed and outdated because liberals are out of power.
Dave I can understand the reasoning behind your comments, let's face it, most Americans did not and still do not understand the electoral vote system in the U.S. We have more votes and we did not win, WTH... Let's be honest as well, if Hillary would have been victorious nothing would have ever been mentioned about the electoral voting system, hell, we even have Ginsburg saying a change is in order. And remind me has she ever said that before in her seating as a judge in any court?? Why the sudden change of heart...?? But the electoral voting system is a part of the United States as we know it. As all things within our government with the right amount of votes it can be changed..The framers of the Constitution didn’t trust direct democracy. Why we have the electoral system: Changing the Electoral College Dave I am typing this from a location 25 miles from the nearest gas station at a whopping 137 kilobytes per second in the tourist mecca of Florida no less, you know Kardashians and Mickey...Ultra modern, sleek Florida, one of the vanguards of the union no less. But there are no sidewalks, fire hydrants or high speed internet as I just attested. How does most of blue American relate to me or how do I relate to them. The ONLY lifeline I have as a fully flanked citizen is a vote that counts for something that resembles equal in spite of our population. If we remove the electoral system I lose the only vestige of power at citizenship in this remote area. Now look back at the maps of the post election results that show ALL THAT RED across the nation and remember that they can relate to my circumstances better than the blue along the coastlines... And I will say it once again as I would rather us work together than apart, it will take the effort of recognizing the differences to bridge the gap. Which we have not seen from the democratic venue. They not only ignored the interior (See Wisconsin) but are more concerned about the differences in who goes to which bathroom than the divides from coastline to interior...
Being honest I think it's a flawed system no matter who wins. People should elect the president..... not regions.... not farmland.... not mountains..... not swamps The electoral system was created in the times of even sparser population in some regions of the country and even denser concentations of voters around the larger cities vs. the rural areas. It's a flawed system for today's America.... especially in a country so divided that the winners either way just look disdainfully at the other side as being political morons and not just as fellow Americans with some differing opinions.
I appreciate your response, we are not much different in our feelings on this. LOL at the swamps, the gator hunters in the bayou are cussing at the moment. Your last paragraph speaks volumes to our current atmosphere which is unfortunate but true. I'm not sure a change would ever protect my vote as a rural located family but I most assuredly understand the sentiment. And isn't understanding our differences the key to what may eventually bring us together again..I cannot shake the idea that we are more alike than different in this great country, we just need to be vigilant in our differences and the circumstances in not only what is around us but what others face on a daily basis... Good post!!
There are only two politics-related "discussions" in which I will participate. One is education, which has been discussed in another topic. The other is the electoral college. Dave, I completely disagree with your assertion that the electoral college is a flawed system. IMO, it's a major part of what keeps our democracy secure and invulnerable to potentially morphing into fascism or socialism. It's population-based, so that argument is invalid. What it isn't is weighted toward the subsections of the states, notably the large urban areas. Clinton did not lose because of a flawed system. IMO one reason of several for her loss is the failure to understand and work against the populist appeal of an opposing candidate who said everything that millions of disgruntled voters wanted to hear, especially those in the rust belt suffering economic hardship. The swing of 3-4 states (WI, MI, OH, PA) by the narrowest of margins was the difference. If she had won both the popular vote and the electoral vote, this never would have been raised as an issue. I'm deeply troubled about the Trump presidency, but as far as I'm concerned, he won fair and square. and he is my president, so I'll support him until I can't. In the meantime, Dave, I'd suggest respectfully that you direct your energy toward more significant issues, like what Trump over-promised during the campaign that he won't be able to deliver during his term as president. Whatever happens, I'm comfortable that our democracy will survive the next 4-8 years intact, thanks in large part to the electoral college. (Edit note: I changed the wording slightly to delete the term "disgruntled masses". After reading Dave's post below, I realized it could be interpreted as a negative label, which clearly was not my intention.)
Thank you Ralph... yours as well. Hopefully we can soon begin to elect leaders who are not so divisive and instead opt for those who sincerely feel the connection that we all should have as Americans first.... political affiliations a distant second.
Yes he did... even if some of it will never happen or wasn't feasible in the first place and/or reeked of alternative facts. But the disgruntled masses aren't really stupid..... they just wanted to hear it.