Et tu, ND?

Discussion in 'The Back Room' started by George Krebs, Dec 12, 2014.

  1. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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    If you think Barack Obama was an outrageous choice to speak at Notre Dame, then learning that they are offering a course named "White Privilege" will most certainly chafe your ass.

    It does mine. How disappointing.

    Just Google it. Lots of stories about it.
     
  2. gipper

    gipper Well-Known Member

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    This was the subject of a report last night on the O'Reilly Factor. It turns out, it's a 1 credit course, taught by an African-American woman who isn't a professor. The class will be for 10 students who have to be acceptable to the teacher.
    The administration who approved this just can't help it. They have their heads up their ass so far that they can't see where they are going. Perhaps if they included in this "class" a section on anti-Semitism and Islamic hatred of infidels it might have some legitimacy. But that wouldn't satisfy the need to spew this **** by some members of our society. Only their view of what's wrong with their life matters.
    The school just can't help itself. The captain at the helm is lost in the real world.
     
  3. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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  4. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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    To make matters worse, today is apparently the 11th anniversary of the murder of two Mishiwaka police officers.

    And, one of the families were in attendance when these girls came out in their new apparel.

    Bad week in South Bend.
     
  5. Terry O'Keefe

    Terry O'Keefe Well-Known Member Administrator

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    What do you guys think of the ND Women wearing "I can't breathe" T-Shirts during warmups for the Michigan game this past weekend? It caused a lot of discusssion over on NDNation, most of which was against it. Logic used was that precedent was set, and that warmup T-Shirts can be used in the future to make other statements. The girls said that they weren't anti-police, just supporting the family.

    The press release by Swarbrick was pretty well done in terms of explaining it, and the girls handled it pretty well in the post game statements.

    Georgetown men also wore those T-Shirts along with Labron of course.
     
  6. Sid

    Sid Well-Known Member

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    I don't have a problem with it, especially after listening to Muffet McGraw's post-game comments (I did not read/hear Swarbrick's comments). Unfortunately, some folks think it's an anti-police message. I don't see it that way. No one respects law enforcement at all levels more than I. IMO the death was due to an incident that shouldn't have happened the way it did. I don't see a connection between the NY incident and the St. Louis incident. IMO the cop in the St. Louis incident was justified by the factual circumstances in using deadly force.
     
  7. Terry O'Keefe

    Terry O'Keefe Well-Known Member Administrator

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  8. Sid

    Sid Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, Terry. Muffet McGraw's comments were along the same general lines.
     
  9. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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    Their shirts should have read " Don't resist arrest when you have a rap sheet that includes multiple priors and 30 arrests, especially when you are out on bail from your last arrest"

    I guess that would have been too hard to read though.
     
  10. gipper

    gipper Well-Known Member

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    Brevity
    DON'T RESIST IF YOU WANT TO EXIST
     
  11. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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    I hope the team feels properly chagrined today for their ill advised publicity stunt.
     
  12. gipper

    gipper Well-Known Member

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    I doubt they get it and won't until guilt becomes required by the pop culture. How about shirts with the slain officer's kids and "Dad will never breath again"
     
  13. IrishCorey

    IrishCorey Well-Known Member

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    here's the thing...

    everything has turned into this game of one-upsmanship and everyone's opinion is somehow turned into an all out attack on the other side. You can want the police held to a higher standard, as anyone who carries the license of lethal force should be, without it being considered an 'attack on law enforcement.' The ideas are not mutually exclusive to one another.

    Law enforcement with their solid blue line doesn't do themselves any favor because their actions are indicative of a group of people who proudly believe that none of their brothers and sisters in the line of duty commit mistakes..and that all law enforcement officers actually belong in law enforcement. I firmly believe that the vast majority of law enforcement are damned good people who do a thankless, difficult job. I also believe that upwards of 10% have no damned business being in that line of work and the absolute refusal to admit that this element exists just makes these situations worse.

    At the same time, the media and the various minority rights groups constantly rush to judge and make every situation out to be more than it actually is. These dead people and burning cities in America are the legacy of 24 hour news 'journalism.' You have the media baiting and inciting each side to bring out their worse, because they get to cover it all. It's manufactured news with very deadly consequences that have a legacy impacts on our society. The fact that we seemingly have no way to hold any of these people truly accountable just adds to the larger problem. The individual components of any one tragedy swap out, but the people stirring the pot each time are exactly the same.

    It's one big never ending game of 'gotcha' that has a cost in real dollars, and worse, real lives. If either side would just take a breath we'd see that the truth lies, as it almost always does, somewhere in between. But no one wants to do that because they're either making money off all this, or too concerned about being righteous.
     
  14. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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    My son has been a NJ State Trooper for almost ten years. He is currently a detective in the Organized Crime / Street Gangs Unit in two of the worst, crime ridden, gang infested cities in NJ and the US. Prior to that he ten years in the military, in combat in Iraq War iI for 28 months. Suffice to say he has more firsthand knowledge of the subject matter than any of us here.

    Blacks are killing each other at a record pace. It's all about gang pride, street cred and drug profits. They assign little or no value to human life. They despise cops. They hate law enforcement so much that shooting victims will not help my son find the person who shot them. Mothers whose sons were gunned down refuse to aid in the investigation. For the most part, there are no fathers on the scene. They are armed in many instances to paramilitary levels. He was part of a six month sting in Camden recently that netted 40 high ranking heroin dealers and traffickers. 38 black and two white. One of the blacks was a Camden cop. In the weeks since, there have been 11 homicides and numerous gun shot woundings as others seek to fill the void. All black on black. No cooperation in the investigation from those living in the neighborhoods.

    Now the cops are receiving credible death threats from sources stating that they will be murdered at their homes by one or another black power group. So now my kid carries two guns on him at all times off duty.

    So for all the talk about opening a dialogue with the "citizens", it really comes down to this. Cops risk their lives daily for the most part to try to protect blacks from killing other blacks. In exchange they are hated by the ones they serve and vilified by those in power. So what do we got to talk about?
     
  15. IrishCorey

    IrishCorey Well-Known Member

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    well, I'll open a little dialogue, or at least try although I doubt you're willing to listen.

    I've taken, what I'd consider to be, beatings on 5 occasions in my life. 4 of them were at the hands of police. Now, I'm sure you're having a chuckle and as my dad used to say 'well, you put yourself in that position to be dealing with the cops, you probably deserved it.'

    See, here's the thing.. No. A police response should not warrant a beating unless you come up swinging at the officers and even then, the beating stops (or should) once you're down. Now before you get too high and mighty, consider this. One of those beatings, I took at the hands of the cops about a crime THAT I CALLED INTO THE POLICE AS A WITNESS. I saw the crime. Asked the clerk at the convenience store for the phone (he wouldn't give it to me) so I asked him to contact the police, which he did. When I asked if I needed to stay at the store, the dispatch informed me that it was not necessary. They were sending cars out. I was walking home the 3 large blocks to my house and they sent the cops in spades. I thought I was going to get a front row seat to some good police work and boy did I. While the guys who were committing the crime watched me get tossed, and then they escaped in their car, I found myself in an ever escalating situation. They jumped out of the cars and bum rushed my ass. I was answering questions while fielding elbows and heavy fists to the face. Have you ever tried to answer a question with a boot to the back of your head, face down in the concrete and your nose smashed up against your face? It's not easy. If you show even the slightest bit of frustration. You're now becoming combative and resisting the officer. By the time the police let me back up to my knees with my hands cuffed behind my back, I was finally able to re-tell my story again. I could tell by their faces that they believed not one word I was saying. The only thing that saved me, quite literally, was the fact that the dipshit Mexican gang bangers came driving back up Central Avenue. You could see the shocked looks on their faces as they past the police and the police looked at them driving the same **** brown older model (even in the 90s) Toyota Corrolla hatch back that I'd been describing the entire time.

    Now I'm sure you're going to say 'oh there's 2 sides to every story' but there's not. Sometimes, there's just asshole officers who abuse their position. You may also say, it's just your own anecdotal tale... but it's just one of them.
     
  16. IrishCorey

    IrishCorey Well-Known Member

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    Here's another beauty. My first real encounter with a police officer.

    I was at a house party in a town home complex down the road from my folks house. My parents probably don't want me to tell this tale, but I will with full disclosure in the hopes that you may possibly see just how deadly serious and honest about this I am being.

    I was **** house drunk. I'd been playing quarters for hours. I'd been winning. We had run out of beer hours before and had been playing with Jack Daniels for probably 2 hours prior. I was just 16 years old, my son's almost that age now. I've always, even as a kid, been able to drink profane amounts of booze while remaining standing and I can fight. Those 2 things are about to be important, but I'm throwing them in now.

    I finally drink all the participants under the table. High school kids. Creepy frat dudes there to haul some high school girls. Just random people who showed up. All the typical yahoos that show up to a thing like that. Anyway I gotta piss. There's drugs and screwing going on in the bathrooms. Neither of those things were my bag and I certainly wasn't going to wait. I ventured off to a dark alleyway with lots of ivy to quietly take a leak and head back. There was an alley and a roadway nearby but the lights had been knocked out by local idiots so it was plenty dark. At that time, I see a group of boys a bit older than me wandering nearby in the area. At first, I thought them to be party goers and paid them no mind, keeping about my business. It wasn't until just before they rushed me that I realized they were a group of Mexican gang bangers. They tackled me and immediately went for my wallet in my back pocket.

    With the modesty that only a 15 year old virgin teenage boy could muster, I kept trying to hold my damned pants on. I just wouldn't let go. I was able to trade punches on occasion, but they finally wised up and coordinated their efforts. It was an absolutely violent struggle for a wallet with maybe 20 bucks in it. Kids are stupid and I was no different. I'm sure the booze didn't help, although I have to admit, I would have fought for that 20 bucks sober as well. Most likely, with a much better outcome. Anyway, I began to realize there was just no way I was keeping a group of 5 guys from ripping my pants off. It was pouring rain, I was soaking wet and they finally got one big tug to pull it off, underwear and everything. Bastards. Before I could turn and fight (because at that point, what dignity do you have anyway?) they just ran. They got what they wanted and had already made too much noise in doing it. So there I am, drunk and naked from the waist down. There's no effing way I'm streaking it to the party and facing that indignity with my friends. I went to the next door I could find. I told the lady exactly what happened. I even told her NOT to open the door (she never did). I told her to call the police because I was taught, the nice policeman will help you. I told her I was embarrassed and I'd just as soon deal with the cops.

    I kinda hid behind a dark tree until the police arrived. I didn't want anyone else to see me, especially anyone I know. The cops arrive and immediately the ridicule begins. I try telling them what happened and they just don't want to listen. They start in with all this **** about being a pervert and blah blah blah. Finally, drunk Corey takes over and starts yelling. A very bad move on my part admittedly, but when you've just been mugged, you're drunk, underage and the people who are supposed to help you are now mocking you, well, you can get a bit frustrated.

    After they got their jollies out, he finally asked me for 'my side' of the story. I told him just as I told you. I admitted to being drunk and underage. I told them I was at a party right there in the complex. I even told them that I saw the guys grab my wallet and discard my pants somewhere over in the ivy by the street. He asked why I didn't go get them and I told them it was fairly well lit, I didn't want to be seen. Then he asked me why I harassed the lady and I told him I simply knocked on her door, told her not to open it but to just call the police. I told her I was mugged, pants-less and embarrassed.

    They didn't go talk to the lady. They didn't look for the party. When I asked them repeatedly to use their mag-lights to look for my pants, they just wandered in the area (after much begging) and claimed that they didn't see it. That's when the fun started. The cop kept insisting that I was lying. Then he started getting physical. He started pushing me and calling me a pervert. Mind you, again, I'm a half naked drunk 16 year old kid who weighed right about 160lbs tops. Here's a grown man, armed starting to give me the toss. Then, I got stupid and cussed him out. I was frustrated more than drunk at that point, and I was really drunk. That cop beat the **** out of me. I honestly couldn't count how many times he slammed my head off the trunk and that rollcage doorway to the back of the car as he was putting me in. I'm handcuffed and this dude is just BEATING THE **** OUT OF ME. They interrogated me for a long time in the car. When I requested that they either take me in and charge me, or take me home, the cop opened the door and dropped **** I dunno... maybe 5 or 6 punches to my head, again, while I am still handcuffed.

    They took me home and I did the half naked walk of shame into the house. At home, I was drunk and quite positively belligerent at that point in time. I passed out on my brothers GI Joe aircraft carrier. I do remember on the ride over that the cop kept telling me he was going to get even with my sick pervert ass.

    Little did I know... that son of a bitch charged me with a effing sex crime. I had to be a REGISTERED SEX OFFENDER until I was 18. That's a 100% true story. I was basically saved from the judicial system by the youth PO who handled my case. My dad and I had to go down and talk with him. I had to admit to all this **** that I didn't do, BUT if I did.. all I had to do was keep a clean sheet until I was 18 and my record would be erased.

    Two last bits about this story.. the next morning, I went back to the scene of the crime to look for my god damned pants. There they were, right where I told the police to look. They weren't even hidden. Now before you go and suggest I planted this evidence, I'd like to remind you I was hand cuffed almost the entire time they were there and I did not return until the next morning with my mom. They never looked. They never looked for the party and they never spoke with the woman in that town home.. which brings me to the last bit...

    I found out years later, the woman in the home was the wife of one of the officer's on the scene. It gets better when I tell you the dude who tossed me around was banging that guy's wife. I have no idea what was going on there, but I do know that 100% of what was in the report was ********. They claimed they interviewed her right there on the scene while I was there. They never knocked on her door. I could see it the entire time.

    Now, as my dad would say, 'that's your fault for going out drinking at 16' and perhaps he's right. That's a crime even. Had they just charged me with that, I would have been fine. But none of that warrants being used as a pinata by these cops. It doesn't warrant their conduct. It doesn't warrant their refusal to investigate any of the claims that I made. Had I never knocked on that woman's door and simply just streaked home to my parents house (about a mile), none of that would have happened.. but then I really would have been doing something wrong. What lesson did that teach me?
     
  17. IrishCorey

    IrishCorey Well-Known Member

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    I got another for ya. You're probably tired of talking about me so let's switch it up a bit.

    You guys follow me on Facebook, right? You see my cousins Kris and John commenting or liking things from time to time. Well, you see, their mother is/was a flat out nutter. She has/had serious mental issues. She was a sick woman. She got all caught up in drugs which makes the mental illness even worse. For a time, she was homeless and she was living in the park right down the street from where my parents live.

    The park, like most parks, has a curfew of sundown (except if you're a cop getting a blowjob but that's another story for another time). This park used to (it may still, I haven't been there in more than 10 years) have this circular set of picnic benches. It was a favorite stop for homeless people looking to get out of the rain and cold. It was covered with a circular grill on each side. The homeless could make a little fire, sleep under the bench and get out of the rain. If you're homeless, it's not a bad gig for a few hours.

    Anyway, the cops got called one night and I guess it was her. They went down there and investigated. She started babbling whatever **** crazy people babble. They went back to their cars and came back with the dogs. They set the dogs on her to flush her out. Now even I would have called ******** on that, except that another friend of mine was making time with his gal at the local public school in the football stadium late at night..and he has a story about 2 cops who happen to match the same 2 K9 cops from John and Kris' story and they set the dogs on him as well. In their incident report, they thought he was attacking the girl. He has the bite scars to this day. It was all big he said she said, but once again, law enforcement prevails.

    Now, sure he shouldn't have been screwing his girlfriend in the high school football stadium after hours and sure she shouldn't have been sleeping in that park... but does the offense really warrant the response?

    I will say, the police in Montclair improved drastically once the city passed a measure stating that the Mayor, City Council, Police Chief and a certain percentage of the police force had to reside in the city of Montclair. It was a drastic change, in fact. Funny how that is.. you stop treating people like animals and most all of them stop acting like animals.
     
  18. IrishCorey

    IrishCorey Well-Known Member

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    so you're probably tired of talking about Montclair and stuff that happened in the 80s and 90s.. okay, well, let's talk about something that happened just a few months ago right here in Decatur Alabama. No, I'm not going to bore you with tales of racial injustice that you've obviously stated your willingness to ignore. Nope, this happened to me right here in my home... about 20 feet from where I'm typing this right now.


    So, I'm home with the baby and a knock comes at the door. NO ONE comes to visit us here so I figured that it must be the UPS or FedEx guys delivering a package from my mom and dad. The baby was still quite new, so it seemed like a solid assumption.

    But, the old hood rat in me still does things certain ways. Like being a former prisoner, there's just some things you don't stop doing because they protect you.

    As I headed to the door, I glanced out the window.. not Fedex or UPS truck, but rather a maroon Chevy Barretta (sic). Now I've got 4 windows across the top of my door and I'm a pretty tall guy comparatively speaking but even I have to get on my tip toes to see out of them. When i saw their was no truck, I figured it was some jackass coming to tell me about his God. I peeked out the windows and I saw a guy who looked like law enforcement in plain clothes. I have this theory about men of a certain age. When they're in too good of shape, they're either cops or homosexuals. Sometimes, both. I'm rarely wrong on this but I'm getting off topic...

    Anyway, as I'm coming down off my tip toes something caught my eye. So I popped back up and asked 'May I help you?' At that time, I saw the blonde guy look up and notice me in the window. I also notice something that looked like a person crouching in the corner next to my front door. I have a deep front doorway (if that makes sense) and you could easily hide right next to the door. The blonde guy says 'Law enforcement. I need you to open the door. '

    I popped down and took a peek out the mail slot. Sure enough, some little bastard was right there in the corner. When I opened it, I heard him kinda exclaim under his breath '****, spotted.'

    I asked him what this was about and again he told me they were law enforcement and I needed to open the door. Now, I know the person who used to live here years ago was fairly sketchy (I still get their mail and we even had some weird dude wander into our home when we first moved in, but that's another story). Anyway, I tell the guy that we just moved here a few months ago and asked them to state their business.

    The guy just kept repeating that he's law enforcement and that I needed to open the door. Since Des passed, I've managed to make a few friends on the Decatur PD so I asked them if they were Decatur PD. The guy said
    No, we're from the "Alabama Bureau of Investigation and we need you to open the door now, sir or we'll be forced to come back with a warrant."

    I tell the guy. You have to forgive me. I'm home alone in a new neighborhood and it's just me and my newborn baby daughter here. I unlocked the door, and started to open it when the little **** in the corner pivoted on his right foot and swung his left foot into my door jam.

    There was a bit of a tense moment that passed (I'm cutting it short) but before long, his partner (the blonde one) told him to back away. The guy did, walking backwards the entire time. So I asked him, 'who are you looking for?' It was a name I'd never even heard of and told them so. I know law enforcement always assumes you're lying, so I immediately ran off a list of references they can contact about me moving in here and how long I've been here. Things seemed to deescalate to I became more helpful, but now they seemed resistant. I started asking questions and they just refused to answer them. Then I started asking questions like 'What's your badge number, so I know who to ask for if I find out any more information?' They also refused to answer that. The dark haired dude started investigating my property and I asked him what the hell he was doing? With that, he turned and they both headed to the car.

    My biggest concern in all of this is my daughter so when they leave, I retreat back into the house to check on her. She's still sleeping and I'm staring at these guys sitting in the car. There's no police radio, which is not uncommon in an unmarked car which they use in drug raids here. Still, I wanted the tag number. I have nothing to mark these guys. I start back outside and head toward the back of their car. The guy puts it in gear and takes off before I can get close enough to see.

    Sensing something fishy, I contact the local PD. The guy puts me on hold and then comes back to tell me that, in fact, the ABI is conducting a few sweeps in the area. When I started mentioning to the cop all of the things that these guys did wrong (ABI conducts themselves entirely different), the guy laughed at me and hung up.

    So I posted a thing on Facebook (some of you may remember this, I'm sure it's still back there). I have a few friends who are Troopers who were also totally alarmed by what I said. One guy told me to contact the ABI. I did and I got the run around. When I told my buddy this, he gave me a number to someone who wouldn't give me the shuffle. This guy wound up taking a report.. he then put me onto a conference call with a guy in the ABI Huntsville office (I was speaking with Birmingham) and when I asked them why such a fuss over a simple report of an asshole agent, the guy told me.

    "We do not have any agents in the field in all of north Alabama at this time, nor will we barring any emergency or unforeseen event. We are not conducting sweeps in the area, but we have received multiple complaints, specifically from the Decatur-Madison-Athens area about people posing as ABI agents and trying to gain entry into homes."

    They promised to follow up with me, but never did. I never let it go. I kept asking. Finally one of my friends here in the DPD told me that something went down a few weeks back in which several officers were called into a meeting. The rumor is, they were doing bounty hunter work on the side while using the resources of the PD to track people and operate their own independent investigations.

    It appears that it was all put down on the down low so as to not draw any negative press with what all is going on with law enforcement..
     
  19. IrishCorey

    IrishCorey Well-Known Member

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    Since I doubt anyone read all that, I'll leave you with this parting shot from a buddy of mine who has been an agent with the FBI for ****.. 20 years now? maybe 15? Anyway, he said... "there's 3 types of people who become cops.

    -The hero
    -The benefits seeker
    -The egomaniac

    The first 2 are the masses in blue and are true heroes. The third is a real ******* problem and they just keep hiring them."

    I have no doubt that George's son is the first and I am not just saying that sucking up. From all that I gather and from you sharing his frustrations with the job at times, I'm quite sure he's one of the good guys.

    But you can't pretend the 3rd doesn't exist and abuses the good will earned, and I mean that, EARNED by the officers such as your son.

    BTW, I believe Michael Brown should have been shot at least once.. maybe not to death but he earned a knee capping at least. Either way, he truly brought that **** on himself. The choke out in New York. I'm sorry, that should have gone down differently but at the same time, like my dad said.. don't put yourself in a position to deal with cops and you don't have to worry about it.
     
  20. George Krebs

    George Krebs Well-Known Member

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    The term hero is used loosely. These are just regular guys doing a job that most of us could not or would not. They are scared just like us. But they work through it. They can take care of themselves in most altercations but they are also expected to take care of you.

    You and I have luxury of time and perspective to discuss the "what ifs", to second guess. A cop's life often depends on his accurate assessment of a situation in a second or two.

    I know my son better than anyone except his mother. I know his weaknesses, his strengths, his hopes and his fears. When you call him for help or someone else calls him to protect them from you, he has to ignore all these things in himself and never let you even have a glimpse of any of them.

    You rightfully thought about your daughter when those dirtbags knocked on your door. My son has to forget his kids when he is thrown into a situation.

    You're dad is right.